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Topic:  General Manager

Topic:  General Manager
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Bobcat Jerry
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Member Since: 5/3/2017
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  Message Not Read  General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 3:12:11 PM 
Sundays announcers for the Duke game said that their new coach hired a "General manager".
Sounds like a Pro basketball team staffing issue....there again is Duke a Pro team.
The big schools are now more than ever the minor league of the NBA.

Last Edited: 3/24/2025 7:21:09 PM by Bobcat Jerry
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OU_Country
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Member Since: 12/6/2005
Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County
Post Count: 8,363

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 3:32:21 PM 
Bobcat Jerry wrote:
Sundays announcers for the Duke game said that their new coach hired a "General manager".
Sounds like a Pro basketball team staffing issue....there again is Duke a Pro team.


Pretty sure there are several teams with this type of position. College basketball as we knew it, and even as we know it now, may cease to exist in the very near future if someone doesn't get their hands around "the wild, wild west" that college athletics has become. I for one am sad about how it's going. Players deserve compensation. Players shouldn't be getting million dollar enticements to jump programs on a whim. That was never the spirit of "NIL" to begin with.
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Bobcat Jerry
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 3:58:02 PM 
OU_Country wrote:
Bobcat Jerry wrote:
Sundays announcers for the Duke game said that their new coach hired a "General manager".
Sounds like a Pro basketball team staffing issue....there again is Duke a Pro team.


Pretty sure there are several teams with this type of position. College basketball as we knew it, and even as we know it now, may cease to exist in the very near future if someone doesn't get their hands around "the wild, wild west" that college athletics has become. I for one am sad about how it's going. Players deserve compensation. Players shouldn't be getting million dollar enticements to jump programs on a whim. That was never the spirit of "NIL" to begin with.


Totally Agree!
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JSF
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Location: Houston, TX
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 4:17:41 PM 
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.

"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

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OU_Country
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Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 4:36:27 PM 
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.
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OhioCatFan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 14,572

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 6:39:20 PM 
OU_Country wrote:
Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


Excellent points! Expect more litigation on those and other issues. The current situation is not set in stone for the foreseeable future. I predict there will be changes, and plenty of them, over the next decade. Stay tuned!

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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Bobcat Tattoo
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Member Since: 12/11/2022
Post Count: 105

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 8:17:03 PM 
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.
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Bobcat Jerry
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Member Since: 5/3/2017
Post Count: 270

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/24/2025 10:12:42 PM 
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


This proposal sounds quite reasonable and hopefully with time enough schools will demand some compensation for financial loss. Not all schools can be winners. Savey schools will start the trend and the copy cats will follow.
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BillyTheCat
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Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 10,246

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/25/2025 5:36:30 AM 
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.
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M.D.W.S.T
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Member Since: 12/23/2021
Post Count: 2,712

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/25/2025 10:42:18 AM 
We have a general manager for football.

Basketball likely isn't far behind.

http://bobcatattack.com/messageboard/topic.asp?FromPage=2...
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GoCats105
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Member Since: 1/31/2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Post Count: 7,362

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/25/2025 10:54:21 AM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.


Schools are already considering dropping out due to the House settlement. I'm curious to know if Ohio is opting in or out, and what MAC schools are opting in or out.

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/a-few-new-thoughts-about-...

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/here-s-why-i-m-hearing-mo...

Last Edited: 3/25/2025 10:54:39 AM by GoCats105
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BillyTheCat
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Post Count: 10,246

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/25/2025 2:58:26 PM 
GoCats105 wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.


Schools are already considering dropping out due to the House settlement. I'm curious to know if Ohio is opting in or out, and what MAC schools are opting in or out.

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/a-few-new-thoughts-about-...

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/here-s-why-i-m-hearing-mo...



Thanks, good reads.
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Bobcat Tattoo
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Member Since: 12/11/2022
Post Count: 105

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/25/2025 7:48:09 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.


Even so, couldn’t the folks paying the NIL $$ still just structure the deal in such a way? Say Burrito Buggy (our favorite fictional example!) pays Elijah Elliott to post ads for them on IG. BB could structure the compensation such that the money is paid out evenly over 4 years, with the stipulation that if Elliott leaves before that 4-year contract period is up, he has to pay back half his earnings to date. This contract wouldn’t involve direct payments to players by the university, and it would have nothing to do with Elliot’s basketball performance.
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BillyTheCat
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Member Since: 10/6/2012
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 5:38:41 AM 
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
JSF wrote:
The NCAA doesn't get nearly as muck flak for this as it deserves. There were people for years who tried to implement a reasonable system for player pay. The NCAA fought it to the death until the courts blew the doors off, leading to what we have now.


Absolutely agree. The NCAA is killing their own golden goose. And at some point, you'd think that "donors" are going to quit being willing to give the kind of money to their respective programs that they are now. I.e., the money well will start to run dry, right?

Players deserve compensation, but with that should come some kind of agreement that they can't transfer without giving back some of the "NIL money" they received. This form of free agency is worse than any professional sport on earth because there are almost no consequences for leaving to a new place every single year. Yes, that's a contract, and that makes them employees, but who the hell are we kidding? That's exactly what is happening now.


I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.


You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.


Even so, couldn’t the folks paying the NIL $$ still just structure the deal in such a way? Say Burrito Buggy (our favorite fictional example!) pays Elijah Elliott to post ads for them on IG. BB could structure the compensation such that the money is paid out evenly over 4 years, with the stipulation that if Elliott leaves before that 4-year contract period is up, he has to pay back half his earnings to date. This contract wouldn’t involve direct payments to players by the university, and it would have nothing to do with Elliot’s basketball performance.


You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 5:39:39 AM by BillyTheCat
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 3,944

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 10:57:01 AM 
BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?


Friendly as ever, Billy.

An NIL deal is between a business and an individual, right? So using the Burrito Buggy as an example, they create a statement of work with milestones and deliverables. They make those deliverables contingent on very obvious and clear business needs: that anybody representing their business be located in the market where they 1) operate or 2) are increasing aiming to increase sales.

The payments are milestone/deliverable based, and if that criteria can't be met for future milestones, the contract is abandoned. It happens constantly and it aint that hard. Without ever having seen any of these agreements, I bet they're structured this way because it's the accepted the legal standard for engaging with independent contractors/B2B engagements for deliverable & project based work, and what any good legal counsel would suggest you do if your #1 priority is making sure no court interprets the relationship as being an employment relationship.

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 10:58:56 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 3:18:33 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?


Friendly as ever, Billy.

An NIL deal is between a business and an individual, right? So using the Burrito Buggy as an example, they create a statement of work with milestones and deliverables. They make those deliverables contingent on very obvious and clear business needs: that anybody representing their business be located in the market where they 1) operate or 2) are increasing aiming to increase sales.

The payments are milestone/deliverable based, and if that criteria can't be met for future milestones, the contract is abandoned. It happens constantly and it aint that hard. Without ever having seen any of these agreements, I bet they're structured this way because it's the accepted the legal standard for engaging with independent contractors/B2B engagements for deliverable & project based work, and what any good legal counsel would suggest you do if your #1 priority is making sure no court interprets the relationship as being an employment relationship.


It is a business agreement. But you think an athlete is going to sign one that locks him in? These kids have representatives at the higher levels. If it was as easy as you say, Smith at OSU would be locked up. No one is contractual to their school through NIL, that’s just not how this works.

I mean yes, XYZ could sign a two year deal with the Buggy, but it’s risky for the Buggy because an NIL CANNON stipulate that XYZ play at OHIO to get paid. That is explicitly against the law and rule of NIL. So why would a collective sign XYZ to a two year contract when next year they may be paying them to play against them.

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 3:29:35 PM by BillyTheCat
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 3,944

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 3:58:04 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?


Friendly as ever, Billy.

An NIL deal is between a business and an individual, right? So using the Burrito Buggy as an example, they create a statement of work with milestones and deliverables. They make those deliverables contingent on very obvious and clear business needs: that anybody representing their business be located in the market where they 1) operate or 2) are increasing aiming to increase sales.

The payments are milestone/deliverable based, and if that criteria can't be met for future milestones, the contract is abandoned. It happens constantly and it aint that hard. Without ever having seen any of these agreements, I bet they're structured this way because it's the accepted the legal standard for engaging with independent contractors/B2B engagements for deliverable & project based work, and what any good legal counsel would suggest you do if your #1 priority is making sure no court interprets the relationship as being an employment relationship.


It is a business agreement. But you think an athlete is going to sign one that locks him in? These kids have representatives at the higher levels. If it was as easy as you say, Smith at OSU would be locked up. No one is contractual to their school through NIL, that’s just not how this works.

I mean yes, XYZ could sign a two year deal with the Buggy, but it’s risky for the Buggy because an NIL CANNON stipulate that XYZ play at OHIO to get paid. That is explicitly against the law and rule of NIL. So why would a collective sign XYZ to a two year contract when next year they may be paying them to play against them.


I know how it works, my man. I also know how businesses structure contracts with independent contractors, and that's what I'm outlining while you tell me about NIL rules in all caps.

Nothing I proposed "locks in" any athletes. Try and follow along, and if you can't, stop being such a snide a*shole all the time.

I outlined how easy it would be to create a business relationship where payments are based on milestones, specific deliverables, and are tied to a business goal that's directly connected to a geographic market. Not a school. I assure you that none of the local businesses in Louisville that Rick Pitino endorsed are still paying him. Why? Because his business value to them was tied to his connection to that market, and they defined that in a contract.

The Burrito Buggy is paying that person for their ability to attract business in the Athens, OH market. Because that's where the Burrito Buggy is, and that's core to the business reason they've identified for entering into the agreement to begin with. If that changes, the value changes to them, and milestones (which are tied to payments) aren't met so less money changes hands. Do you know a lot of businesses where every single dollar in the lifetime value changes hands upfront? Or is money often times used to, you know, incentivize the exchange of goods and/or services?

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 3:59:45 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 4:54:12 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?


Friendly as ever, Billy.

An NIL deal is between a business and an individual, right? So using the Burrito Buggy as an example, they create a statement of work with milestones and deliverables. They make those deliverables contingent on very obvious and clear business needs: that anybody representing their business be located in the market where they 1) operate or 2) are increasing aiming to increase sales.

The payments are milestone/deliverable based, and if that criteria can't be met for future milestones, the contract is abandoned. It happens constantly and it aint that hard. Without ever having seen any of these agreements, I bet they're structured this way because it's the accepted the legal standard for engaging with independent contractors/B2B engagements for deliverable & project based work, and what any good legal counsel would suggest you do if your #1 priority is making sure no court interprets the relationship as being an employment relationship.


It is a business agreement. But you think an athlete is going to sign one that locks him in? These kids have representatives at the higher levels. If it was as easy as you say, Smith at OSU would be locked up. No one is contractual to their school through NIL, that’s just not how this works.

I mean yes, XYZ could sign a two year deal with the Buggy, but it’s risky for the Buggy because an NIL CANNON stipulate that XYZ play at OHIO to get paid. That is explicitly against the law and rule of NIL. So why would a collective sign XYZ to a two year contract when next year they may be paying them to play against them.


I know how it works, my man. I also know how businesses structure contracts with independent contractors, and that's what I'm outlining while you tell me about NIL rules in all caps.

Nothing I proposed "locks in" any athletes. Try and follow along, and if you can't, stop being such a snide a*shole all the time.

I outlined how easy it would be to create a business relationship where payments are based on milestones, specific deliverables, and are tied to a business goal that's directly connected to a geographic market. Not a school. I assure you that none of the local businesses in Louisville that Rick Pitino endorsed are still paying him. Why? Because his business value to them was tied to his connection to that market, and they defined that in a contract.

The Burrito Buggy is paying that person for their ability to attract business in the Athens, OH market. Because that's where the Burrito Buggy is, and that's core to the business reason they've identified for entering into the agreement to begin with. If that changes, the value changes to them, and milestones (which are tied to payments) aren't met so less money changes hands. Do you know a lot of businesses where every single dollar in the lifetime value changes hands upfront? Or is money often times used to, you know, incentivize the exchange of goods and/or services?



What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 6:24:47 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


It is actually exactly what's happening in many, many cases. That you aren't capable of reading what I'm saying and understanding it doesn't change that.

Tons and tons of athletes are getting paid by brands per Instagram post. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about -- a contract that's based on specific deliverables and milestones. A "deliverable" would be the post itself; the milestones would be a number of posts and cadence of posts within a certain timeline before payment is issued. I'm sure they even have kickers when certain engagement metrics are met.

When Mark Sears was still here there was some local company that paid him for some Instagram posts. I forget who it was. Do you think they're still paying him? He just did a post for Cava. How do you think that contract was structured? Think they dropped a briefcase full of cash at his house or did they maybe get a contract signed?

Also, here's an analysis from ESPN of actual NIL contracts: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/44107758/n...

Quote:

LeRoy, who reviewed several contracts obtained by ESPN, said the deals meet several key standards in a legal test that federal courts have established to determine if someone is an employee. As they roughly defined, an employee is someone performing services for another party's benefit in exchange for compensation while under that party's control.

The contracts viewed by ESPN are structured, in part, as licensing deals where the school is buying the rights to use the athlete's NIL in promotions. Payments for those rights are separate from the tuition and other academic-related funding athletes receive from their schools.

Many of the contracts explicitly state that athletes are not employees and are not being paid for playing on the team. However, experts say, the fine print might be deemed in a court challenge to contradict those assertions.

Part of the argument, they say, focuses on the amount of control that the schools impose on athletes in this exchange. The transfer portal has emerged as one of the principal ways athletes can leverage their talents to get a better deal, but contractual language seems designed to limit players' maneuverability.

Several of the contracts and templates require players (or their future teams) to pay a buyout fee if athletes decide to transfer schools before the end of the contract. Most let the school stop paying athletes immediately if they enter the transfer portal -- or if they or their agent even express interest in a transfer. .


The contracts do the exact thing Bobcat Tattoo suggested. Far more aggressively than my suggestions, in fact. It took me 2 minutes of googling to know more about this than you do with all of your "insider" info.

But the good news is that your streak of simultaneously being very, very wrong and a condescending prick remains unbroken. 10,244 posts of that and counting. An impressive streak.

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 6:43:13 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Bobcat Tattoo
General User



Member Since: 12/11/2022
Post Count: 105

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:04:54 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


It is actually exactly what's happening in many, many cases. That you aren't capable of reading what I'm saying and understanding it doesn't change that.

Tons and tons of athletes are getting paid by brands per Instagram post. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about -- a contract that's based on specific deliverables and milestones. A "deliverable" would be the post itself; the milestones would be a number of posts and cadence of posts within a certain timeline before payment is issued. I'm sure they even have kickers when certain engagement metrics are met.

When Mark Sears was still here there was some local company that paid him for some Instagram posts. I forget who it was. Do you think they're still paying him? He just did a post for Cava. How do you think that contract was structured? Think they dropped a briefcase full of cash at his house or did they maybe get a contract signed?

Also, here's an analysis from ESPN of actual NIL contracts: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/44107758/n...

Quote:

LeRoy, who reviewed several contracts obtained by ESPN, said the deals meet several key standards in a legal test that federal courts have established to determine if someone is an employee. As they roughly defined, an employee is someone performing services for another party's benefit in exchange for compensation while under that party's control.

The contracts viewed by ESPN are structured, in part, as licensing deals where the school is buying the rights to use the athlete's NIL in promotions. Payments for those rights are separate from the tuition and other academic-related funding athletes receive from their schools.

Many of the contracts explicitly state that athletes are not employees and are not being paid for playing on the team. However, experts say, the fine print might be deemed in a court challenge to contradict those assertions.

Part of the argument, they say, focuses on the amount of control that the schools impose on athletes in this exchange. The transfer portal has emerged as one of the principal ways athletes can leverage their talents to get a better deal, but contractual language seems designed to limit players' maneuverability.

Several of the contracts and templates require players (or their future teams) to pay a buyout fee if athletes decide to transfer schools before the end of the contract. Most let the school stop paying athletes immediately if they enter the transfer portal -- or if they or their agent even express interest in a transfer. .


The contracts do the exact thing Bobcat Tattoo suggested. Far more aggressively than my suggestions, in fact. It took me 2 minutes of googling to know more about this than you do with all of your "insider" info.

But the good news is that your streak of simultaneously being very, very wrong and a condescending prick remains unbroken. 10,244 posts of that and counting. An impressive streak.


Beat me to it, BLSS! That last paragraph you highlighted is precisely what I was getting at. And, to Billy’s point about contracts for playing on the team being disallowed, your example with Burrito Buggy is effectively a way around it. Structure the contract such that the player has to promote the business in-person, say, once per week for the duration of the contract. Technically they could still transfer and continue to trek back to Athens every weekend to maintain their income stream, but that would be the stuff of comedy if it actually happened!

And, true, some players may be reluctant to sign such a deal, but many others won’t. Again, coaches do this 95% of the time—it may just take a while to catch on with the athletes.
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BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 10,246

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:04:56 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


It is actually exactly what's happening in many, many cases. That you aren't capable of reading what I'm saying and understanding it doesn't change that.

Tons and tons of athletes are getting paid by brands per Instagram post. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about -- a contract that's based on specific deliverables and milestones. A "deliverable" would be the post itself; the milestones would be a number of posts and cadence of posts within a certain timeline before payment is issued. I'm sure they even have kickers when certain engagement metrics are met.

When Mark Sears was still here there was some local company that paid him for some Instagram posts. I forget who it was. Do you think they're still paying him? He just did a post for Cava. How do you think that contract was structured? Think they dropped a briefcase full of cash at his house or did they maybe get a contract signed?

Also, here's an analysis from ESPN of actual NIL contracts: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/44107758/n...

Quote:

LeRoy, who reviewed several contracts obtained by ESPN, said the deals meet several key standards in a legal test that federal courts have established to determine if someone is an employee. As they roughly defined, an employee is someone performing services for another party's benefit in exchange for compensation while under that party's control.

The contracts viewed by ESPN are structured, in part, as licensing deals where the school is buying the rights to use the athlete's NIL in promotions. Payments for those rights are separate from the tuition and other academic-related funding athletes receive from their schools.

Many of the contracts explicitly state that athletes are not employees and are not being paid for playing on the team. However, experts say, the fine print might be deemed in a court challenge to contradict those assertions.

Part of the argument, they say, focuses on the amount of control that the schools impose on athletes in this exchange. The transfer portal has emerged as one of the principal ways athletes can leverage their talents to get a better deal, but contractual language seems designed to limit players' maneuverability.

Several of the contracts and templates require players (or their future teams) to pay a buyout fee if athletes decide to transfer schools before the end of the contract. Most let the school stop paying athletes immediately if they enter the transfer portal -- or if they or their agent even express interest in a transfer. .


The contracts do the exact thing Bobcat Tattoo suggested. Far more aggressively than my suggestions, in fact. It took me 2 minutes of googling to know more about this than you do with all of your "insider" info.

But the good news is that your streak of simultaneously being very, very wrong and a condescending prick remains unbroken. 10,244 posts of that and counting. An impressive streak.


You miss the topic. NONE of those lock a player into a school. If you got it figured out, you’ve got a lot of money on the table in fees. Go get you some! Don’t dream about it be about it! Our players need help navigating this NIL landscape, please for Bobcatnation, go help us all. Get these guys paid and tied into long term contracts.
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BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 10,246

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:07:43 PM 
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


It is actually exactly what's happening in many, many cases. That you aren't capable of reading what I'm saying and understanding it doesn't change that.

Tons and tons of athletes are getting paid by brands per Instagram post. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about -- a contract that's based on specific deliverables and milestones. A "deliverable" would be the post itself; the milestones would be a number of posts and cadence of posts within a certain timeline before payment is issued. I'm sure they even have kickers when certain engagement metrics are met.

When Mark Sears was still here there was some local company that paid him for some Instagram posts. I forget who it was. Do you think they're still paying him? He just did a post for Cava. How do you think that contract was structured? Think they dropped a briefcase full of cash at his house or did they maybe get a contract signed?

Also, here's an analysis from ESPN of actual NIL contracts: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/44107758/n...

Quote:

LeRoy, who reviewed several contracts obtained by ESPN, said the deals meet several key standards in a legal test that federal courts have established to determine if someone is an employee. As they roughly defined, an employee is someone performing services for another party's benefit in exchange for compensation while under that party's control.

The contracts viewed by ESPN are structured, in part, as licensing deals where the school is buying the rights to use the athlete's NIL in promotions. Payments for those rights are separate from the tuition and other academic-related funding athletes receive from their schools.

Many of the contracts explicitly state that athletes are not employees and are not being paid for playing on the team. However, experts say, the fine print might be deemed in a court challenge to contradict those assertions.

Part of the argument, they say, focuses on the amount of control that the schools impose on athletes in this exchange. The transfer portal has emerged as one of the principal ways athletes can leverage their talents to get a better deal, but contractual language seems designed to limit players' maneuverability.

Several of the contracts and templates require players (or their future teams) to pay a buyout fee if athletes decide to transfer schools before the end of the contract. Most let the school stop paying athletes immediately if they enter the transfer portal -- or if they or their agent even express interest in a transfer. .


The contracts do the exact thing Bobcat Tattoo suggested. Far more aggressively than my suggestions, in fact. It took me 2 minutes of googling to know more about this than you do with all of your "insider" info.

But the good news is that your streak of simultaneously being very, very wrong and a condescending prick remains unbroken. 10,244 posts of that and counting. An impressive streak.


Beat me to it, BLSS! That last paragraph you highlighted is precisely what I was getting at. And, to Billy’s point about contracts for playing on the team being disallowed, your example with Burrito Buggy is effectively a way around it. Structure the contract such that the player has to promote the business in-person, say, once per week for the duration of the contract. Technically they could still transfer and continue to trek back to Athens every weekend to maintain their income stream, but that would be the stuff of comedy if it actually happened!

And, true, some players may be reluctant to sign such a deal, but many others won’t. Again, coaches do this 95% of the time—it may just take a while to catch on with the athletes.


What you don’t get is no player is signing that contract and it’s not NIL legal, which is its own law. You really think you two have invented something!?


Go make your money! Cash that shit in! You got the NIL answer, go make it!
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
General User

Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 3,944

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:24:56 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:

You miss the topic. NONE of those lock a player into a school. If you got it figured out, you’ve got a lot of money on the table in fees. Go get you some! Don’t dream about it be about it! Our players need help navigating this NIL landscape, please for Bobcatnation, go help us all. Get these guys paid and tied into long term contracts.


He said:

Bobcat Tattoo wrote:

I am honestly shocked we haven’t seen any contracts like this for NIL yet. Something like “we’ll pay you $100K per season for 4 years, but if you leave early we recoup 50%.” It’s exactly what is done for coaches (buyout clauses), and, if players can be paid directly (I.e. are employees), there’s no reason such a contract shouldn’t hold up against legal challenges.



You said:

BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t have said contract, because the NIL is for anything BUT performance. Until they become employees, going to be very hard to legally restrain this trade. And when they do become employees, you’ll see schools drop out of this rat race.


He said:

Bobcat Tattoo wrote:

Even so, couldn’t the folks paying the NIL $$ still just structure the deal in such a way? Say Burrito Buggy (our favorite fictional example!) pays Elijah Elliott to post ads for them on IG. BB could structure the compensation such that the money is paid out evenly over 4 years, with the stipulation that if Elliott leaves before that 4-year contract period is up, he has to pay back half his earnings to date. This contract wouldn’t involve direct payments to players by the university, and it would have nothing to do with Elliot’s basketball performance.



You said:

BillyTheCat wrote:

You can’t bind a student to that school. Do you think no one has thought of this yet?



Then you said:

BillyTheCat wrote:

What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


And I shared evidence that that's exactly how contracts have been written.

Explain why you've been such an as*hole here and what warranted it, exactly?

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 9:26:50 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
General User

Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 3,944

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:28:39 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you don’t get is no player is signing that contract and it’s not NIL legal, which is its own law. You really think you two have invented something!?


Go make your money! Cash that shit in! You got the NIL answer, go make it!


This is just sad at this point, Billy. The ESPN article is about actual, signed contracts with players in the two richest leagues in the country.

Last Edited: 3/26/2025 9:29:56 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Bobcat Tattoo
General User



Member Since: 12/11/2022
Post Count: 105

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: General Manager
   Posted: 3/26/2025 9:32:36 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Bobcat Tattoo wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:


What you propose though is not what’s happening and or what is going to happen in the immediate future. Why you like living in a fantasy world? That’s is up to you.


It is actually exactly what's happening in many, many cases. That you aren't capable of reading what I'm saying and understanding it doesn't change that.

Tons and tons of athletes are getting paid by brands per Instagram post. That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about -- a contract that's based on specific deliverables and milestones. A "deliverable" would be the post itself; the milestones would be a number of posts and cadence of posts within a certain timeline before payment is issued. I'm sure they even have kickers when certain engagement metrics are met.

When Mark Sears was still here there was some local company that paid him for some Instagram posts. I forget who it was. Do you think they're still paying him? He just did a post for Cava. How do you think that contract was structured? Think they dropped a briefcase full of cash at his house or did they maybe get a contract signed?

Also, here's an analysis from ESPN of actual NIL contracts: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/44107758/n...

Quote:

LeRoy, who reviewed several contracts obtained by ESPN, said the deals meet several key standards in a legal test that federal courts have established to determine if someone is an employee. As they roughly defined, an employee is someone performing services for another party's benefit in exchange for compensation while under that party's control.

The contracts viewed by ESPN are structured, in part, as licensing deals where the school is buying the rights to use the athlete's NIL in promotions. Payments for those rights are separate from the tuition and other academic-related funding athletes receive from their schools.

Many of the contracts explicitly state that athletes are not employees and are not being paid for playing on the team. However, experts say, the fine print might be deemed in a court challenge to contradict those assertions.

Part of the argument, they say, focuses on the amount of control that the schools impose on athletes in this exchange. The transfer portal has emerged as one of the principal ways athletes can leverage their talents to get a better deal, but contractual language seems designed to limit players' maneuverability.

Several of the contracts and templates require players (or their future teams) to pay a buyout fee if athletes decide to transfer schools before the end of the contract. Most let the school stop paying athletes immediately if they enter the transfer portal -- or if they or their agent even express interest in a transfer. .


The contracts do the exact thing Bobcat Tattoo suggested. Far more aggressively than my suggestions, in fact. It took me 2 minutes of googling to know more about this than you do with all of your "insider" info.

But the good news is that your streak of simultaneously being very, very wrong and a condescending prick remains unbroken. 10,244 posts of that and counting. An impressive streak.


Beat me to it, BLSS! That last paragraph you highlighted is precisely what I was getting at. And, to Billy’s point about contracts for playing on the team being disallowed, your example with Burrito Buggy is effectively a way around it. Structure the contract such that the player has to promote the business in-person, say, once per week for the duration of the contract. Technically they could still transfer and continue to trek back to Athens every weekend to maintain their income stream, but that would be the stuff of comedy if it actually happened!

And, true, some players may be reluctant to sign such a deal, but many others won’t. Again, coaches do this 95% of the time—it may just take a while to catch on with the athletes.


What you don’t get is no player is signing that contract and it’s not NIL legal, which is its own law. You really think you two have invented something!?


Go make your money! Cash that shit in! You got the NIL answer, go make it!


Dude, did you even read the article BLSS posted? The idea that “no player is signing this contract” is just patently false, and your insistence that this is “not NIL legal” seems tenuous as best. And, no, I am not under any illusion that I “invented” anything, nor did I claim to have done so.

Get some rest, my man!
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