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Topic:  RE: WKU / MTSU watch

Topic:  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
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OhioBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/8/2021 11:56:10 PM 
Jeff McKinney wrote:
I knew the MAC would screw this up. It's like they are so insular that they have no ability to close a deal on any expansion.


What exactly is the MAC screwing up? What would the MAC actually being "adding" by bringing these two in exactly? For every one thing they would/could add, they offset it but taking away/canceling something else out. One could easily make the argument the MAC is better/stronger the way it is without them. Remember, the MAC doesn't need these two schools. The question is, do those two schools need the MAC? Maybe that answer is no. Prior to two weeks ago, no MAC fan was scanning the nation's landscape saying the MAC needs to add WKU and MTSU. No one was.
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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:02:05 AM 
OhioBobcat wrote:
Jeff McKinney wrote:
I knew the MAC would screw this up. It's like they are so insular that they have no ability to close a deal on any expansion.


What exactly is the MAC screwing up? What would the MAC actually being "adding" by bringing these two in exactly? For every one thing they would/could add, they offset it but taking away/canceling something else out. One could easily make the argument the MAC is better/stronger the way it is without them. Remember, the MAC doesn't need these two schools. The question is, do those two schools need the MAC? Maybe that answer is no. Prior to two weeks ago, no MAC fan was scanning the nation's landscape saying the MAC needs to add WKU and MTSU. No one was.


Is this the talking points from the MAC office being beta tested here on BA? Asking for a friend.


"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:27:58 AM 
Jeff McKinney wrote:
I knew the MAC would screw this up. It's like they are so insular that they have no ability to close a deal on any expansion.


If this falls through, it won't be the MAC's fault. It won't be WKU's fault.

It will be because MTSU piddled around due to lack of $$$$$$. Some people think that Middle is of the opinion that the few million bucks (chump change for most D-1 athletic programs) they could keep by not changing leagues will somehow fund major improvements on their facilities and make them look bigtime. With construction costs these days? In the Nashville area?

delusional

> based on or having faulty judgment; mistaken.


Last Edited: 11/9/2021 12:34:11 AM by greencat

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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:31:16 AM 
greencat wrote:
Jeff McKinney wrote:
I knew the MAC would screw this up. It's like they are so insular that they have no ability to close a deal on any expansion.


If this falls through, it won't be the MAC's fault. It won't be WKU's fault.

It will be because MTSU piddled around due to lack of $$$$$$. Some people think that Middle is of the opinion that the few million bucks (chump change for most D-1 athletic programs) they could keep by not changing leagues will somehow fund improvements on their facilities and make them look bigtime. With construction costs these days? In the Nashville area?

de·lu·sion·al
/dəˈlo͞oZH(ə)nəl/

> based on or having faulty judgment; mistaken.




If that's the case, why not just take WKU? We can operate with uneven divisions, and it might make MTSU deal with reality, and beg to get in before the ink is dry on the WKU contract. Does the MAC know how to negotiate or not?


"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:37:07 AM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
greencat wrote:
Jeff McKinney wrote:
I knew the MAC would screw this up. It's like they are so insular that they have no ability to close a deal on any expansion.


If this falls through, it won't be the MAC's fault. It won't be WKU's fault.

It will be because MTSU piddled around due to lack of $$$$$$. Some people think that Middle is of the opinion that the few million bucks (chump change for most D-1 athletic programs) they could keep by not changing leagues will somehow fund improvements on their facilities and make them look bigtime. With construction costs these days? In the Nashville area?

de·lu·sion·al
/dəˈlo͞oZH(ə)nəl/

> based on or having faulty judgment; mistaken.




If that's the case, why not just take WKU? We can operate with uneven divisions, and it might make MTSU deal with reality, and beg to get in before the ink is dry on the WKU contract. Does the MAC know how to negotiate or not?


People who are delusional don't deal in reality. They fantasize about the Big12 calling in a couple of years and inviting them in...because... well... ???
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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 8:33:11 AM 
Just saw on the MTSU forum that the B O T is meeting there today and the last listing on the agenda is athletics.

This might be the tipping point... join the MAC or forever hold your piece.

(As the UMass talk heats back up)
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CatsUp
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 9:35:10 AM 
I am on board with both WKU and MTSU coming to the MAC but if MTSU decides to roll the dice differently I am warming up to the WKU and UMass idea otherwise (if it’s indeed going to be on the table).

Not having MT really doesn’t throw out the idea of eventually combining a future trip to Nashville since WKU would be involved. In fact, for me in south central Ohio, WKU is closer and only about 1:10 from Nashville. Murfreesboro is an hour on the other side of Nashville. I also think UMass will be much more engaged and appreciative of being in the MAC this time around. Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint. And, who knows, for basketball, some of the folks on the committee, who are probably on the “mature side”, may remember “the good ole days” of Minutemen basketball which could give the conference a psychological advantage and, dare I say, a second team in the tournament that wouldn’t have been there otherwise. While this last thought might be a stretch, I think most would agree a lot of things are questioned when it comes to the selection committee and how they arrive at their decisions.

WKU could still include MT on their schedules as out of conference games if they so choose.
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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 10:40:20 AM 
I think something really being missed out on is that Chattanooga is only 90 minutes more than Murfreesboro and the last 50 miles of the drive are beautiful. And the big thing, ut-C has a 10,000 seat basketball arena and a D-1 FBS ready football stadium. They could easily move up to FBS.

Chattanooga football stadium:
https://gomocs.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thu...

Chattanooga basketball arena:
https://gomocs.com/images/2012/10/7/RXKKZVBCNNSFUNX.20121...

What lots of the drive between Murf. and Chatt. looks like...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/0tHystV3cdIU019hF...
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f1/0b/1b/f10b1b872743f1e53...

Last Edited: 11/9/2021 11:09:41 AM by greencat

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CatsUp
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 10:54:28 AM 
greencat wrote:
I think something really being missed out on is that Chattanooga is only 90 minutes more than Murfreesboro and the last 50 miles of the drive are beautiful. And the big thing, ut-C has a 10,000 seat basketball arena and a D-1 FCS ready football stadium. They could easily move up to FCS.

Chattanooga football stadium:
https://gomocs.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thu...

Chattanooga basketball arena:
https://gomocs.com/images/2012/10/7/RXKKZVBCNNSFUNX.20121...

What lots of the drive between Murf. and Chatt. looks like...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/0tHystV3cdIU019hF...
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f1/0b/1b/f10b1b872743f1e53...


The looks of the football stadium, the basketball arena…AND…the drive (have just the car for it)…I think you’ve convinced me. :)
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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 11:13:21 AM 
greencat wrote:
I think something really being missed out on is that Chattanooga is only 90 minutes more than Murfreesboro and the last 50 miles of the drive are beautiful. And the big thing, ut-C has a 10,000 seat basketball arena and a D-1 FCS ready football stadium. They could easily move up to FCS.

Chattanooga football stadium:
https://gomocs.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thu...

Chattanooga basketball arena:
https://gomocs.com/images/2012/10/7/RXKKZVBCNNSFUNX.20121...

What lots of the drive between Murf. and Chatt. looks like...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/0tHystV3cdIU019hF...
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f1/0b/1b/f10b1b872743f1e53...




Actually, Chattanooga is only about ten miles farther from Athens than Murfreesboro is. Their stadium is a little small -- 21,000 -- but it holds more fans than most MAC teams get at a typical game anyway. I think the big issue for any team south of Kentucky is fan interest in the MAC. UTC's in the Southern Conf, which is loaded with teams from neighboring states. It might take several years for fans to get used to us northern schools. When Temple and then UMass were in the MAC, most fans didn't even know it.

If talks with UMass are heating up, the MAC should really get another team from the East Coast on board to make them less of an outlier (assuming that WKU won't join the MAC without MTSU). Army would be ideal. Their schedule is already loaded with G5 schools, including several from the MAC. UConn has four or five money games every year with "P" schools, so they likely wouldn't want to give that up.

Last Edited: 11/9/2021 11:14:14 AM by Pataskala


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 11:13:38 AM 
CatsUp wrote:
greencat wrote:
I think something really being missed out on is that Chattanooga is only 90 minutes more than Murfreesboro and the last 50 miles of the drive are beautiful. And the big thing, ut-C has a 10,000 seat basketball arena and a D-1 FCS ready football stadium. They could easily move up to FCS.

Chattanooga football stadium:
https://gomocs.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thu...

Chattanooga basketball arena:
https://gomocs.com/images/2012/10/7/RXKKZVBCNNSFUNX.20121...

What lots of the drive between Murf. and Chatt. looks like...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/0tHystV3cdIU019hF...
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f1/0b/1b/f10b1b872743f1e53...


The looks of the football stadium, the basketball arena…AND…the drive (have just the car for it)…I think you’ve convinced me. :)


I went to see Santana not long ago (for the zillionth time) but went to see him in Chattanooga instead of here in middle TN. Stayed at the beautiful and historic Read House hotel and walked the 6 blocks to the also ancient historic Soldiers and Sailors Memorial Auditorium to the show. Went to the Top of the Rock Brewhouse on the way to Chatt.

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?pb=!1s0x8861a9e6475b9b25%3...

Last Edited: 11/9/2021 11:14:26 AM by greencat

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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 11:40:47 AM 
greencat wrote:
I think something really being missed out on is that Chattanooga is only 90 minutes more than Murfreesboro and the last 50 miles of the drive are beautiful. And the big thing, ut-C has a 10,000 seat basketball arena and a D-1 FBS ready football stadium. They could easily move up to FBS.

Chattanooga football stadium:
https://gomocs.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thu...

Chattanooga basketball arena:
https://gomocs.com/images/2012/10/7/RXKKZVBCNNSFUNX.20121...

What lots of the drive between Murf. and Chatt. looks like...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/0tHystV3cdIU019hF...
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f1/0b/1b/f10b1b872743f1e53...


Chattanooga also has a really nice aquarium (and is the home of Moon Pies!!!!)
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Jeff McKinney
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:10:11 PM 
Chattanooga would be a fantastic addition, but it ain't gonna happen. I think the SoCon is a great fit for them..
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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 12:52:49 PM 
CatsUp wrote:
… Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint.


UMASS isn’t really a great improvement for Buffalo in road trip terms. New York is a LARGE state, East to West. Buffalo is much closer to Cleveland than NYC or Mass.

UB’s North (Main) campus is approximately 6 hours from Amherst MA (GoogleMaps is currently quoting 5hr 41min). That is longer than the driving time (h:mm) to:
Akron (3:25)
Kent (3:27)
EMU (4:51)
Bowling Green (4:53)
Toledo (4:57)
Mt. pleasant (5:50).

And only marginally shorter than the drive to Athena (which Google, rather optimistically, puts at 6:04).

Even if you slap on an extra hour for the driving times to EMU and CMU, 5-6 current MAC schools are an easier drive from Buffalo than UMASS is
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GoCats105
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 1:02:23 PM 
All the cards are on Middle Tennessee's table. They're refusing to join the MAC because they think collecting the exit fees from the schools that left C-USA is a better solution than joining the stability of the MAC with WKU alongside.

Short term, yes. Those exit fees pay a nice chunk of change. But long term it's a horrible strategy. C-USA's TV deal is terrible and it could get worse with all the exits. Not to mention all the potential travel and instability.

For once, the MAC didn't screw this up. They may need some help from ESPN and CBS to sweeten the deal.


https://twitter.com/38Godfrey/status/1458128438007635972?...
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CatsUp
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 1:26:28 PM 
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
… Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint.


UMASS isn’t really a great improvement for Buffalo in road trip terms. New York is a LARGE state, East to West. Buffalo is much closer to Cleveland than NYC or Mass.

UB’s North (Main) campus is approximately 6 hours from Amherst MA (GoogleMaps is currently quoting 5hr 41min). That is longer than the driving time (h:mm) to:
Akron (3:25)
Kent (3:27)
EMU (4:51)
Bowling Green (4:53)
Toledo (4:57)
Mt. pleasant (5:50).

And only marginally shorter than the drive to Athena (which Google, rather optimistically, puts at 6:04).

Even if you slap on an extra hour for the driving times to EMU and CMU, 5-6 current MAC schools are an easier drive from Buffalo than UMASS is



Buffalo NY to Murfreesboro TN: 736 miles (11 hours 13 minutes). Granted, any potential divisional assignments are an unknown.

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 1:35:11 PM 
GoCats105 wrote:
All the cards are on Middle Tennessee's table. They're refusing to join the MAC because they think collecting the exit fees from the schools that left C-USA is a better solution than joining the stability of the MAC with WKU alongside.

Short term, yes. Those exit fees pay a nice chunk of change. But long term it's a horrible strategy. C-USA's TV deal is terrible and it could get worse with all the exits. Not to mention all the potential travel and instability.

For once, the MAC didn't screw this up. They may need some help from ESPN and CBS to sweeten the deal.


https://twitter.com/38Godfrey/status/1458128438007635972?...


I imagine that adding Jacksonville St, JMU and Liberty made the CUSA situation more palatable for MTSU, but if they think about it, it's not that great. JMU and Liberty are both about eight hours from MTSU. At least half the current MAC teams are about that close or closer to MTSU (Ohio, MOFO, BSU, BG, Toledo, Akron and Kent). EMU, WMU and NIU are as close or closer to MTSU as LaTech, the next closest CUSA school. So with the new CUSA they would have four opponents within about nine hours but ten current MAC teams are in that range.


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 3:04:09 PM 
CatsUp wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
… Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint.


UMASS isn’t really a great improvement for Buffalo in road trip terms. New York is a LARGE state, East to West. Buffalo is much closer to Cleveland than NYC or Mass.

UB’s North (Main) campus is approximately 6 hours from Amherst MA (GoogleMaps is currently quoting 5hr 41min). That is longer than the driving time (h:mm) to:
Akron (3:25)
Kent (3:27)
EMU (4:51)
Bowling Green (4:53)
Toledo (4:57)
Mt. pleasant (5:50).

And only marginally shorter than the drive to Athena (which Google, rather optimistically, puts at 6:04).

Even if you slap on an extra hour for the driving times to EMU and CMU, 5-6 current MAC schools are an easier drive from Buffalo than UMASS is



Buffalo NY to Murfreesboro TN: 736 miles (11 hours 13 minutes). Granted, any potential divisional assignments are an unknown.



No argument about the driving time from Buffalo to Murfreesboro, that would be the new longest (about 2 hours longer than driving from Buffalo to Dekalb, depending on traffic). I was more making the point that UMASS isn’t that close to Buffalo, and that Akron and Kent would remain inarguably the closest schools to Buffalo
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CatsUp
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 4:07:37 PM 
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
… Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint.


UMASS isn’t really a great improvement for Buffalo in road trip terms. New York is a LARGE state, East to West. Buffalo is much closer to Cleveland than NYC or Mass.

UB’s North (Main) campus is approximately 6 hours from Amherst MA (GoogleMaps is currently quoting 5hr 41min). That is longer than the driving time (h:mm) to:
Akron (3:25)
Kent (3:27)
EMU (4:51)
Bowling Green (4:53)
Toledo (4:57)
Mt. pleasant (5:50).

And only marginally shorter than the drive to Athena (which Google, rather optimistically, puts at 6:04).

Even if you slap on an extra hour for the driving times to EMU and CMU, 5-6 current MAC schools are an easier drive from Buffalo than UMASS is



Buffalo NY to Murfreesboro TN: 736 miles (11 hours 13 minutes). Granted, any potential divisional assignments are an unknown.



No argument about the driving time from Buffalo to Murfreesboro, that would be the new longest (about 2 hours longer than driving from Buffalo to Dekalb, depending on traffic). I was more making the point that UMASS isn’t that close to Buffalo, and that Akron and Kent would remain inarguably the closest schools to Buffalo


Fair enough. I can see both points. Mine leaned more toward comparing Buffalo’s driving distance to MTSU vs UMass.

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 4:11:52 PM 
CatsUp wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
CatsUp wrote:
… Furthermore, I think Buffalo might welcome an additional manageable road trip and not being quite the outlier in the footprint.


UMASS isn’t really a great improvement for Buffalo in road trip terms. New York is a LARGE state, East to West. Buffalo is much closer to Cleveland than NYC or Mass.

UB’s North (Main) campus is approximately 6 hours from Amherst MA (GoogleMaps is currently quoting 5hr 41min). That is longer than the driving time (h:mm) to:
Akron (3:25)
Kent (3:27)
EMU (4:51)
Bowling Green (4:53)
Toledo (4:57)
Mt. pleasant (5:50).

And only marginally shorter than the drive to Athena (which Google, rather optimistically, puts at 6:04).

Even if you slap on an extra hour for the driving times to EMU and CMU, 5-6 current MAC schools are an easier drive from Buffalo than UMASS is



Buffalo NY to Murfreesboro TN: 736 miles (11 hours 13 minutes). Granted, any potential divisional assignments are an unknown.



No argument about the driving time from Buffalo to Murfreesboro, that would be the new longest (about 2 hours longer than driving from Buffalo to Dekalb, depending on traffic). I was more making the point that UMASS isn’t that close to Buffalo, and that Akron and Kent would remain inarguably the closest schools to Buffalo


Fair enough. I can see both points. Mine leaned more toward comparing Buffalo’s driving distance to MTSU vs UMass.



That’s fair. Amherst (NY) to Amherst (MA) is definitely an easier drive for fans or non-FB/non-MBB than Amherst (NY) to Murfreesboro
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.
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/9/2021 6:30:41 PM 
I really don’t care either way. I’m fine if they join, not going to lose any sleep if they don’t.

Marshall was the only team I wanted back, but they’re too butthurt to ever admit they erred in leaving.
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ts1227
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/10/2021 6:36:24 PM 
The foreplay is over, MAC staying at 12

https://getsomemaction.com/news/2021/11/10/general-mid-am...

Last Edited: 11/10/2021 6:38:44 PM by ts1227

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/10/2021 8:18:43 PM 
ts1227 wrote:
The foreplay is over, MAC staying at 12

https://getsomemaction.com/news/2021/11/10/general-mid-am...


Wouldn't call it foreplay. I'm reminded of my favorite line by the preacher in "Blazing Saddles": "Oh, Lord. Do we have the strength to perform this mighty task in one night? Or are we just jerking off?"

Last Edited: 11/10/2021 8:19:21 PM by Pataskala


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/10/2021 9:38:59 PM 
I feel bad for Western Kentucky, but i think that this does make more sense than going to 13 teams again or adding them and UMASS or them and UCONN (or any of the more esoteric options)
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ts1227
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  Message Not Read  RE: WKU / MTSU watch
   Posted: 11/10/2021 10:19:38 PM 
Pataskala wrote:
ts1227 wrote:
The foreplay is over, MAC staying at 12

https://getsomemaction.com/news/2021/11/10/general-mid-am...


Wouldn't call it foreplay. I'm reminded of my favorite line by the preacher in "Blazing Saddles": "Oh, Lord. Do we have the strength to perform this mighty task in one night? Or are we just jerking off?"


There were a lot of people leaving today with blue balls
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