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That seems to qualify as an over and back violation as I understand it. No one seemed upset about it...what am I missing...The shot attempt or contact with rim/backboard negates over and back? Back to Top BillyTheCat General User Member Since: 10/6/2012 Post Count: 10,410 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 11:30:54 AM  jumper80 wrote: In the Akron game last night. The Akron center went up for a monster slam that shot off the back iron. The ball shot across half court and Akron player retrieved it. That seems to qualify as an over and back violation as I understand it. No one seemed upset about it...what am I missing...The shot attempt or contact with rim/backboard negates over and back? On a shot attempt, the release of a shot ends team control of the ball, hence, no over and back until the ball is possessed again. Back to Top bornacatfan General User Member Since: 8/3/2006 Post Count: 5,716 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 11:32:03 AM  ANy shot attempt negates possession. never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. Winter comes and asks how you spent your summer..... The game loves and rewards those who love and reward the game Back to Top JustABobcatFan General User Member Since: 2/5/2015 Post Count: 28 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 11:37:29 AM  I had the same question too until I realized it hit the rim which consist of changing possession. Don't worry, you were not the only one yelling for over and back. HAHA!! Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 12:10:24 PM  Is rolling around on your back on the floor while possessing the ball still a traveling violation? Back to Top OU77BCJ General User Member Since: 11/18/2010 Post Count: 83 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 12:31:07 PM  If you were watching the ref, he gave a signal that means he did not have possesion of the ball, juggling. Back to Top OhioStunter General User Member Since: 2/18/2005 Location: Chicago Post Count: 2,516 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 12:52:12 PM  However, if that shot goes out of bounds, is it a possession arrow call or is it considered last touched by Akron and it becomes Ohio's ball? Back to Top shabamon General User Member Since: 11/17/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 6,878 Status: Online     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 12:54:23 PM  Out of bounds off Akron. Ohio ball. Let's say there's a fight for a loose ball that gets knocked out of bounds. The team who did not touch it last would have possession, doesn't matter if there was no team/player control. Same idea. Back to Top bobcat695 General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Parkersburg, WV Post Count: 1,345 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 1:06:16 PM  It's just a long rebound. On this topic, I am amazed at the general fan's interpretation of the rules. I cringe every time I hear someone yell, "He's over the back!" There is no such rule prohibiting reaching or jumping over someone. A foul only occurs if there is a pushing or blocking call. "You can't un-fist a fist pump." - Saul Phillips 1/24/15 Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 1:22:19 PM  OU77BCJ wrote: If you were watching the ref, he gave a signal that means he did not have possesion of the ball, juggling. I guess I was watching the Akron player rolling on the floor and not the ref, right before the scrum ended with a McAdams three. Back to Top jumper80 General User Member Since: 5/11/2006 Post Count: 123 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 1:44:51 PM  Thanks ...40 years of playing none of my monster jams ever did that ;) Back to Top Deciduous Forest Cat General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Ohio Post Count: 4,474 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 2:01:02 PM  bobcat695 wrote: It's just a long rebound. On this topic, I am amazed at the general fan's interpretation of the rules. I cringe every time I hear someone yell, "He's over the back!" There is no such rule prohibiting reaching or jumping over someone. A foul only occurs if there is a pushing or blocking call. Yes, of course the rule isn't actually called that, but it's what people say when the potential rebounder commits a foul by jumping into another player or pushes. Not to mention, I've seen on several occasions referees making an "over the back" gesture that looks sorta like a double swim move. Back to Top OU77BCJ General User Member Since: 11/18/2010 Post Count: 83 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 2:42:55 PM  I was also watching him roll on the floor, just that after, everyone was yelling, including me and the ref made the juggling motion meaning he did not have control of the ball. Back to Top shabamon General User Member Since: 11/17/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 6,878 Status: Online     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 3:32:24 PM  I referee youth basketball and have covered 3rd - 7th grade games. Sometimes I do the double swim gesture to demonstrate to young players the incorrect movement. College officials should not do that. Back to Top Alan Swank General User Member Since: 12/11/2004 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 7,234 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 3:37:49 PM  Deciduous Forest Cat wrote: bobcat695 wrote: It's just a long rebound. On this topic, I am amazed at the general fan's interpretation of the rules. I cringe every time I hear someone yell, "He's over the back!" There is no such rule prohibiting reaching or jumping over someone. A foul only occurs if there is a pushing or blocking call. Yes, of course the rule isn't actually called that, but it's what people say when the potential rebounder commits a foul by jumping into another player or pushes. Not to mention, I've seen on several occasions referees making an "over the back" gesture that looks sorta like a double swim move. Yes and no. There are people who actually believe that you can not going over someone's back to rebound a ball whether you touch them or not. I heard that several times at the Athens - St. V game Saturday night when there was obviously no contact. Back to Top shabamon General User Member Since: 11/17/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 6,878 Status: Online     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 3:56:12 PM  IF THERE IS NO CONTACT THERE IS NO FOUL. Parents scream at me all the time about moving screens when the defender is trying to run around the screener. Tell your kid to make contact and I'll call the offensive foul. Back to Top GroverBall General User Member Since: 12/3/2012 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 1,281 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 4:34:38 PM  Alan Swank wrote: Deciduous Forest Cat wrote: bobcat695 wrote: It's just a long rebound. On this topic, I am amazed at the general fan's interpretation of the rules. I cringe every time I hear someone yell, "He's over the back!" There is no such rule prohibiting reaching or jumping over someone. A foul only occurs if there is a pushing or blocking call. Yes, of course the rule isn't actually called that, but it's what people say when the potential rebounder commits a foul by jumping into another player or pushes. Not to mention, I've seen on several occasions referees making an "over the back" gesture that looks sorta like a double swim move. Yes and no. There are people who actually believe that you can not going over someone's back to rebound a ball whether you touch them or not. I heard that several times at the Athens - St. V game Saturday night when there was obviously no contact. I'm with DFC on this one and a bit tired of the regular "OMG don't you know there's no such thing!" that appears on this board. I've also never encountered anyone who thinks it's a foul without contact. Just because we hear it being said in gyms regularly doesn't mean the speaker isn't just using the term to express his or her thought that the contact came from behind/on top of shoulders and/or head. Are we really so picky that we want to dictate how fans express their belief that a foul has occurred? But I guess everyone has their pet peeves - this one just gets pointed out too often IMHO. Back to Top OUVan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Bethesda, MD Post Count: 5,580 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 5:18:44 PM  GroverBall wrote: I'm with DFC on this one and a bit tired of the regular "OMG don't you know there's no such thing!" that appears on this board. I've also never encountered anyone who thinks it's a foul without contact. Just because we hear it being said in gyms regularly doesn't mean the speaker isn't just using the term to express his or her thought that the contact came from behind/on top of shoulders and/or head. Are we really so picky that we want to dictate how fans express their belief that a foul has occurred? But I guess everyone has their pet peeves - this one just gets pointed out too often IMHO. I'm with you. Who cares what you call it. You know what they mean. Would it make everyone happier if it was called "Through the back"? Back to Top OUVan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Bethesda, MD Post Count: 5,580 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 5:20:45 PM  Okay, here's a rules question that I have seen interpreted differently by different refs. On an inbound play after a non-basket a player is not allowed to run the baseline. Is he restricted to a certain area or does he have to maintain a pivot foot as if he was on the court? While coaching I've been told different things by the refs. Back to Top The Bozone General User Member Since: 12/29/2004 Post Count: 21 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 9:18:08 PM  Art. 8. The following pertain to a designated spot: a The designated spot is the location at which a thrower-in is presented disposal of the ball out of bounds as in 4-11.1.a through .c. b. The designated spot shall be 3-feet wide with no depth limitation. c. The thrower-in must keep one foot on or over the designated spot until the ball is released. Pivot foot restrictions and the traveling rule are not in effect for a throw-in. Back to Top RSBobcat General User Member Since: 8/22/2010 Location: Columbus, OH Post Count: 4,437 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/5/2015 11:41:32 PM  As far as semantics goes Over The Back = Hand Check = Both are Fouls (and descriptions of Contact) RS Bobcat Back to Top JustABobcatFan General User Member Since: 2/5/2015 Post Count: 28 Status: Offline     RE: rules question    Posted: 2/7/2015 12:02:41 AM  bobcat695 wrote: It's just a long rebound. On this topic, I am amazed at the general fan's interpretation of the rules. I cringe every time I hear someone yell, "He's over the back!" There is no such rule prohibiting reaching or jumping over someone. A foul only occurs if there is a pushing or blocking call. I remember being told in Basketball Officiating class in high school is as long as they are not making contact, then it isn't a foul. If the person behind the defender simply jumps straight up and takes the ball over the defenders head, then no foul. But like you said, if he pushes or basically reaches over the defender causing contact then, you make the "over the back" call. It's a touchy call and the only reason I agree with it is if the defender boxes out and is then pushed or reached over not allowing them to rebound. 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