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Topic:  Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons

Topic:  Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
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shabamon
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Member Since: 11/17/2006
Location: Cincinnati
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  Message Not Read  Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 4:38:27 PM 
Who you got?
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OU_Country
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Member Since: 12/6/2005
Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County
Post Count: 8,343

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 4:41:15 PM 
I'll take DJ Cooper all day, but I'll reserve the right to change that opinion after we see this year and next from Preston.
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FearLeon
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Member Since: 3/12/2005
Post Count: 4,319

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 7:27:17 PM 
1A-Cooper
1B-Preston
3-Simmons

Like OUCountry.....rankings subject to change 18 months from now.

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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GroverBall
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Member Since: 12/3/2012
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 1,246

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 8:33:09 PM 

Simmons does not belong in this conversation IMHO
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Bobcat1998
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 8:36:50 PM 
GroverBall wrote:
Simmons does not belong in this conversation IMHO



I know he was a scorer but I will take Geno over Jaaron. I will also take one year of Fears. I will also take Mark Sears. Basically I cannot stand that Jaaron left us to average 2 ppg and 1 apg.
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jumper80
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 8:58:58 PM 
GroverBall wrote:
Simmons does not belong in this conversation IMHO



100% agree
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A-townBound
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Member Since: 3/31/2012
Location: Georgetown, KY
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/2/2020 10:00:52 PM 
Agree with all comments above ^

Bleed Green and GO OHIO!!
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OUVan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Bethesda, MD
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 9:50:56 AM 
GroverBall wrote:
Simmons does not belong in this conversation IMHO



While I 100% agree, sophomore year Jaaron was very good. If he had stayed in that path and style of play he might have gotten up to #3. He didn't.
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Donuts
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 10:46:58 AM 
Preston
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Bobcat Love
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 11:12:20 AM 
OUVan wrote:
GroverBall wrote:
Simmons does not belong in this conversation IMHO



While I 100% agree, sophomore year Jaaron was very good. If he had stayed in that path and style of play he might have gotten up to #3. He didn't.


Might have gotten to play up to 3 minutes a game at Michigan....he didn't.
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The Optimist
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Location: CLE
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 11:31:02 AM 
Preston really reminds me a lot of Cooper. That court vision...

I've seen crazier things happen.

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 11:49:24 AM 
A lot of anti-Minnesota recruiting bias here. What about Zach Keikow and Stephen King?

I lean Preston here. I loved Cooper, but point guards with size, shooting, athleticism and court vision are worth their weight in gold. As good as Cooper was, he shot us out of more than a few games in his career.

Last Edited: 12/3/2020 11:49:52 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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OUVan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Bethesda, MD
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 11:51:46 AM 
The Optimist wrote:
Preston really reminds me a lot of Cooper. That court vision...


I agree. Two totally different types of players but each has elite court vision. Cooper stands as the clear #1 for me right now but Preston has the opportunity to get there with him.
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Bobcat Love
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 11:55:29 AM 
By the way, it's Cooper - Anecdotally for sure, analytically I don't have time to look. I'm not sure it's real close at this point either.

Better shooter, better passer, better vision - elevated his supporting cast, and did it against a better "night in/night out" Mid-American Conference. Plus he did it on a National Stage in 2 separate years. Straight up legit.

Preston might be a better rebounder, but I still think he's very flawed defensively (At 45, I could get him off the ground with a head fake), and his shot is not close to DJ's.

That said, Preston is making bigger incremental leaps from year to year - I think he can make a huge stride next year on his shot and his D - which he has to do if he wants to play at the next level. DJ may have actually regressed from his Junior to Senior year even if the numbers don't reflect it. Preston has a better frame/body than DJ as well.

I don't even know why Simmons is in this conversation.
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Eagle66
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Member Since: 3/13/2005
Post Count: 1,329

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 12:45:45 PM 
Im not sure anyone will wow me with passes like DJ did. However, I would argue that Preston is a better shooter than DJ was. So I looked up the stats. DJ’s best season shooting (42.4% FG%) is lower than Preston’s worst (43.4%)

DJ career stats
FG% - 38.0
FG3% - 32.2
FT% - 74.2
eFG% - 46.0

Preston thus far in his career
FG% - 49.8
FG3% - 35.5
FT% - 71.8
eFG% - 54.2

I’d reserve a final judgement until we see how Prestons career plays out.

Last Edited: 12/3/2020 12:46:30 PM by Eagle66
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GoCats105
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Member Since: 1/31/2006
Location: Seattle, WA
Post Count: 7,070

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 1:29:15 PM 
Fears

---

In all seriousness...

I've said this many times, and I'm gonna duck and cover after posting this: name a better PG than Jaaron Simmons not named DJ Cooper in the last 25 years of Ohio basketball. Today, you could say Preston. A couple years ago, you couldn't. Jaaron was either first or second in the nation in assists at one point during his Sophomore year. I'd argue he was better at getting to the basket than DJ was and a stronger finisher at the rim.

He didn't have the court vision or defense DJ had, but Jaaron's decision to go to Michigan (and his dribbling out the clock without a shot in the MAC Tournament) taints how good he really was.

That being said...

Cooper
Preston
Simmons

Before Preston arrived and exploded recently, you had to put Simmons at #2 if you step back and look at his actual play on the court.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jaaron-simmo...

Last Edited: 12/3/2020 1:37:49 PM by GoCats105
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OUVan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Bethesda, MD
Post Count: 5,580

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 1:42:26 PM 
What about Dink Whitaker? He played in a "dead period" for me (just after I left Athens and before the explosion of college basketball on TV) so I never actually saw him play but his numbers get your attention. Anyone want to shed some light on his game?
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FearLeon
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Member Since: 3/12/2005
Post Count: 4,319

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 3:18:07 PM 
OUVan wrote:
What about Dink Whitaker? He played in a "dead period" for me (just after I left Athens and before the explosion of college basketball on TV) so I never actually saw him play but his numbers get your attention. Anyone want to shed some light on his game?


I was there for Dink's senior year. For him to put up those numbers when that team truly was a one-man team (Dave Jamerson) was astounding. To this day, I still say getting 12 wins out of that roster was Larry Hunter's greatest coaching job. For crying out loud, a football player was the starting center...Jerry LeBold.

I overlooked him at first...Dink is definitely ahead of "dribble out the clock" Simmons.

Last Edited: 12/3/2020 3:19:07 PM by FearLeon

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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100%Cat
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Member Since: 1/17/2013
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 5:13:15 PM 
Are we really having this discussion without Bean Willis?
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SBH
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 3,941

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 5:22:25 PM 
Bean was the World B. Free of MAC basketball.
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Bobcatzblitz
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Member Since: 7/21/2010
Post Count: 1,727

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 6:27:12 PM 
LOVED BEAN..KID STAYED HIGH..MOTOR

SERIOUSLY HE WAS FUN
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OUVan
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Location: Bethesda, MD
Post Count: 5,580

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 7:50:34 PM 
Bobcatzblitz wrote:
LOVED BEAN..KID STAYED HIGH..MOTOR

SERIOUSLY HE WAS FUN


Yeah, 10 win seasons with Maurice Ndour and Tony Campbell on the roster are a blast.
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Deciduous Forest Cat
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Ohio
Post Count: 4,378

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 8:44:22 PM 
Bobcat Love wrote:
By the way, it's Cooper - Anecdotally for sure, analytically I don't have time to look. I'm not sure it's real close at this point either.

Better shooter, better passer, better vision - elevated his supporting cast, and did it against a better "night in/night out" Mid-American Conference. Plus he did it on a National Stage in 2 separate years. Straight up legit.

Preston might be a better rebounder, but I still think he's very flawed defensively (At 45, I could get him off the ground with a head fake), and his shot is not close to DJ's.

That said, Preston is making bigger incremental leaps from year to year - I think he can make a huge stride next year on his shot and his D - which he has to do if he wants to play at the next level. DJ may have actually regressed from his Junior to Senior year even if the numbers don't reflect it. Preston has a better frame/body than DJ as well.

I don't even know why Simmons is in this conversation.


I can go along with much of this except for the shooting part. DJ was just about the slickest passer that I've ever seen, but when he put the ball up, especially from 3, you never knew what you were going to get. He could certainly get hot and take over a game, but JP has a legit shot night in/night out. They're both creative in different ways in the paint.

Another advantage to JP... I was almost always comfortable if the ball was in DJ's hands, but JP NEVER turns the ball over. It's almost uncanny. How great a stat was that to go along with his 31 points and 8 assists last week?

It's awesome the way he's blown up this week, but if Jason P gets us to the Sweet 16, then we can talk Cooper-esque legacy. Edit-add: I think the NBA talk is way premature, but keep chopping wood.

Last Edited: 12/3/2020 8:46:56 PM by Deciduous Forest Cat
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Jeff Hill
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 8:59:58 PM 
Let us not forget Diamond Gladney!
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100%Cat
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Member Since: 1/17/2013
Post Count: 2,535

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  Message Not Read  RE: Preston vs. Cooper vs. Simmons
   Posted: 12/3/2020 9:41:36 PM 
Jeff Hill wrote:
Let us not forget Diamond Gladney!


Or Ladrell Whitehead.
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