BobcatAttack.com - For Fans of Ohio University Sports

Welcome Guest!
Create an Account

site search

where to watch

about us

advertise with us

help

BobcatAttack.com Message Board

Ohio Basketball

Topic: RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Topic: RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Author

Message

FearLeon
General User

Member Since: 3/12/2005
Post Count: 4,203

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 7:30:54 AM

Sorry...but when you make comments like this one....

“I’m still disappointed that we’re not in the NCAA Tournament,” Offutt said. “I’m not a fan of secondary tournaments like this.”

...then expect to take the heat when you absolutely don't show up for what you know could be your final collegiate game.

I know people want to go on and on about sharing a MAC title, but this team regressed and underachieved.
Coach or no coach leaving, with your top 10 players returning, they should've taken the leap… you know like Gonzaga and Butler before them. Built on past success.

What they did was panic against an Akron team without its starting point guard in the MAC Championship game and then got beat in front of 1000 people by an average Denver squad with their 2nd best player taking the night off.

Add in the massive step backs that Ivo and Kellogg had this year too and nobody should be jumping up and down over "sharing" a MAC regular season crown. Why are many on this board so happy with one magical run? Everyone seems to believe that Christian's plan will work moving forward with his guys in his system. It's going to be interesting to revisit this discussion a year from now.

Seriously- did we want to be Butler or Gonzaga (or VCU) where we are a dominant mid major who just keeps retooling and coming back or are we that classic MAC team like so many before us who have one or two fluke years and then go back to mediocrity?

Last Edited: 3/20/2013 7:44:38 AM by FearLeon

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

Bhugh24
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 50

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 9:31:09 AM

FEAR LEON - read this post from another thread from BOBCAT LOVE SHAME....things don't automatically get better every year...its a process. Check out the path VCU has taken...it's not all NCAA sweet 16's every year....

"Frankly, I don't think Gonzaga is a realistic comp or example for us. They made the tournament in 1999, won some games, and have been there every year since. They made a very conscious decision to fund their program and put it on par with national programs. They may not spend quite as much on basketball as a Duke or Kansas, but their annual basketball expenditures are closer to Duke than we are to Gonzaga. Likewise, Butler is a private school that was able to build on two final four runs and pay a very large amount of money over a long period of years to retain Brad Stevens. There are advantages to the private school model that OU simply can't match at this point.

In my mind, the comp that makes more sense is VCU. It's a public school that traditionally has had far less athletic success than other in-state public schools (UVA/Va Tech). They don't own the Virginia market, and even in Richmond they were considered the also-ran behind U of R for years. What they did, however, was manage to parlay a period of about 10 years of strong basketball into long term, prolonged success. And, contrary to popular belief, they didn't do it overnight and they didn't go to the tournament every year in the process.

Jeff Capel helped to build a strong program there, but never won an NCAA tournament game for them. Next, they hired an assistant from a big time program (Anthony Grant) who beat Duke in the first round of the tournament in his first year. The next year, they were upset by W&M in the CAA tournament, and missed the NCAA's and lost in the NIT in the first round. The year following, they went 24-10, won the regular season CAA title, but lost to UCLA in the first round of the NCAAs. At which point, Grant left for Alabama. So, if you're keeping score, between Capel and Grant, VCU compiled a 155-66 record and won a single NCAA tournament game.

Skaka Smart was then given the head job, and proceeded to go 27-9, which included 7 losses in conference, missed the NCAA tournament but ended up winning the CBI. You know, the tournament people around here think is beneath us. Finally, in 2011, they broke through by getting into the tournament as an at large, winning their play in game against USC, and famously knocking off Georgetown, Purdue, Florida State, and Kansas on their way to the final four. Since then, they've been to the tournament every year, and they've committed a ton of money to Smart and been added to the Atlantic 10.

So, what's the point? The point is that we need to be realistic and patient regarding our definition of success. VCU didn't beat Duke under Anthony Grant and then make the NCAA tournament every year after, what they did was establish a culture of winning, compete consistently for an NCAA tournament spot, recruit well, and most importantly, win a ton of basketball games. Bottom line is this: if you win games consistently, regardless of whether or not they're regular season games, CBI games, NIT games, or NCAA tournament games, people will take notice. If you're viewed as a program that's always competing for a spot in the NCAA tournament, recruits will take notice. And Jim Christian has shown he can win basketball games in this league, and while last year's run apparently made people impatient and spoiled and led them to believe that the only games that matter for a program like ours take place in the NCAA tournament, that's simply not the case. If we want to take the next step, we need to win a lot over a long period of time, consistently. Christian is the winningest coach in MAC history, percentage wise. If he continues that, it will mean very good things for our program, and the people who are jumping ship already have no sense of what it actually takes to build a long term winning program. It's not going to happen over night. There aren't going to be annual sweet 16 runs. But there will be a lot of wins, and if wins over teams like BG, Ball State, and Buffalo aren't good enough for you, I've got bad news: you're a fan of the wrong team. Because that's who we play. "

Casper71
General User

Member Since: 12/1/2006
Post Count: 2,896

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 9:52:30 AM

Stunter hit it on the head. This group did not get better this year end of story. I tend to think they got maximum performances out of their abilities last year when it counted. Other than a co-championship, we just didn't perform well against better teams this year. DJ and Reg at least worked at it each and every game...even if going 0-8. Ivo, walt and nic had different stories. At times throughout the year they just completely disappeared. Give ivo credit last night for really hitting the boards. Problem was walt completely disappeared (seriously, how does a two year starter who is the heart and sould of the team get zeroes everywhere) and nic must have been looking for him because he was more or less MIA.

All-in-all, a great four years. I will never forget St. Louis either. All the fans going bonkers for 40+ minutes and taking one of the storied program to the brink...PRICELESS! This year, not so much...

C Money
General User

Member Since: 8/28/2010
Post Count: 3,420

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 10:11:34 AM

Bhugh24 wrote:

So, what's the point? The point is that we need to be realistic and patient regarding our definition of success. VCU didn't beat Duke under Anthony Grant and then make the NCAA tournament every year after, what they did was establish a culture of winning, compete consistently for an NCAA tournament spot, recruit well, and most importantly, win a ton of basketball games. Bottom line is this: if you win games consistently, regardless of whether or not they're regular season games, CBI games, NIT games, or NCAA tournament games, people will take notice. If you're viewed as a program that's always competing for a spot in the NCAA tournament, recruits will take notice. And Jim Christian has shown he can win basketball games in this league, and while last year's run apparently made people impatient and spoiled and led them to believe that the only games that matter for a program like ours take place in the NCAA tournament, that's simply not the case. If we want to take the next step, we need to win a lot over a long period of time, consistently. Christian is the winningest coach in MAC history, percentage wise. If he continues that, it will mean very good things for our program, and the people who are jumping ship already have no sense of what it actually takes to build a long term winning program. It's not going to happen over night. There aren't going to be annual sweet 16 runs. But there will be a lot of wins, and if wins over teams like BG, Ball State, and Buffalo aren't good enough for you, I've got bad news: you're a fan of the wrong team. Because that's who we play. "

Sports fandom is neither realistic nor patient. Nor is it rational. There is nothing rational about losing sleep over what 18-22 year olds do simply because they happen to attend the same school you went to.

No. Sports fandom is an undulating emotional beast, and as horrible as the lows feel sometimes, we can't kill the beast because the highs are great. It's a drug. And like any drug to an addict, when you're feeling low, all you want to do is feel that high again.

I think some people tend to forget that 2009-10 was largely a fluke. We were a 9 seed in the MAC tournament. We got lucky with an incredibly talented transfer who got incredibly hot at the right time and carried the team to the NCAAs.

But the sports fan doesn't want to look at it that way. The sports fan wants to remember dominating a Georgetown team that we were told we had no chance against. The sports fan wants to remember DJ's no-look to DeVaughn. The sports fan wants to remember every person in America talking about THE OHIO BOBCATS!!!!!

The sports fan doesn't want to remember how non-competitive we were against Tennessee the very next game. The sports fan doesn't want to remember getting bounced from the MAC tournament by Ball State in 2011. The sports fan doesn't want to remember that our Sweet 16 run last year was largely the function of very favorable match-ups.

Those are the lows of sports fandom. We only want the highs.

My point? It's easy to remember the good things and forget the bad things. The only reason it stings this bad right now is because we were so high this time last year. Do I KNOW if Jim Christian will be able to succeed at OHIO? No. We have a single data point, which isn't enough to establish a trend. I think he will. But that's not the sports fan in me. The sports fan in me cares very little about any of that right now, because I will not be high again this year.

Until the football team upsets a top 10 ranked Louisville team on the last Saturday in August.

Or until the Reds fire Dusty Baker. That will do it too.

Rhino_Cat
General User

Member Since: 1/19/2006
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 7

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 10:48:45 AM

FearLeon, I couldn't agree with you more. Well said.

You're never as good as everyone tells you when you win, and you're never as bad as they say when you lose.

KC Bobcat
General User

Member Since: 11/22/2006
Location: Norfolk, VA
Post Count: 256

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:01:46 AM

C Money wrote:

Spot on. Great post. Although as an Orioles fan, I care nothing about Dusty Baker.

OUVan
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Bethesda, MD
Post Count: 5,580

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:19:56 AM

C Money wrote:

Pataskala
General User

Member Since: 7/8/2010
Location: At least six feet away from anybody else
Post Count: 9,180

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:21:40 AM

CM, all you had to say is "Cubs fans." It's the anticipation, it's the watching, it's the enjoying, it's the highs, it's the lows, it's the memories.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

OhioCatFan
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 14,036

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 12:06:22 PM

Pataskala wrote:

CM, all you had to say is "Cubs fans." It's the anticipation, it's the watching, it's the enjoying, it's the highs, it's the lows, it's the memories.

I resemble that remark. Ernie Banks, my childhood hero, would say "Let's play three!" In other words, always look ahead to the next game, be positive and have fun. GO OHIO!

P.S. One of my recently acquired prized possession is an autographed ball from Ernie that I got for donating to his Live Above and Beyond Foundation.

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

Bobcatzblitz
General User

Member Since: 7/21/2010
Post Count: 1,727

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 12:13:29 PM

I have played basketball and the effort by Walt WAS there..when a player is tanking the game he doesnt play defense and usually chucks the ball..not the case with Walt though I'm curious if any plays were drawn for him.

Mark Lembright '85
General User

Member Since: 8/22/2010
Location: Highland Heights, OH
Post Count: 2,447

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 12:16:07 PM

Bhugh24 wrote:

I guess the $1,000,000 question is, is Coach Christian our Shaka Smart? Time will tell.

Last Edited: 3/20/2013 12:16:42 PM by Mark Lembright '85

Andrew Ruck
General User

Member Since: 12/22/2004
Location: Columbus, OH
Post Count: 4,788

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 12:26:50 PM

Walt has deactivated his twitter account.

Andrew Ruck
B.B.A. 2003

bornacatfan
General User

Member Since: 8/3/2006
Post Count: 5,707

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 10:55:14 PM

BillyTheCat wrote:

Comments?

I dunno Coach

YOu know as well as I that there are nights that kids do not get good looks. I thought he competed. I did not think he had much chance to get going. From the accounts of the folks in the arena and what I saw in the exchange between him and ST on the bad switch he looked fairly into the game. Just because you have driving lanes cut off and don't take ill advised shots does not mean you checked out.

As a Coach I am sure you have had really good players not get a shot off some nights. If the plan of the opposition is to neutralize you then you sometimes have to defer and try to get other players involved. He had a bad night. They had him bottled up. Fouls were frustrating. Until I hear it from Walt that he did not feel he gave it 100% then I will have to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I am sure there was a let down that he had after he poured heart and soul into getting back to hte dance. I am sure his comment in the original article reflected his drive and singualr purpose. If you look around the good programs in Indiana we do not hang runner up banners. It is a culture of winning or losing. There are no other accolades. Tommy has 2 state runner ups along with the team that lost to Milan and the next one that lost to Oscar Robertson. Ray McCallum reminds him that he has 2 banners when he sees him.

I did not see him bailing out on d or chucking shots like Bert and Ernie did in their swan song or others did in at Eastern in 11. I did see him hustle back on D and he was pretty lathered up in the close ups on the bench.....Unless I hear from him directly, I assume it was a bad night on the o end . He is still one of the Bobcats I will remember for leaving it all on the floor, every lift, every practice, every drill, every minute setting the example for everyone who had to press to keep up.

If you are looking to throw it up in my face Coach have at it. Just think though if it was one of your players in that spot. Would you tell her to hold her head up or would you rip her for not showing up the last game of the career and negate everything contributed beforehand?

never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Winter comes and asks how you spent your summer.....

The game loves and rewards those who love and reward the game

RSBobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/22/2010
Location: Columbus, OH
Post Count: 4,404

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:17:09 PM

Question Walt's commitment, heart, soul, effort, etc. - and I gotta question your knowledge of the man, and/or the motives of your post.

RS Bobcat

bornacatfan
General User

Member Since: 8/3/2006
Post Count: 5,707

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:45:23 PM

RSBobcat wrote:

Question Walt's commitment, heart, soul, effort, etc. - and I gotta question your knowledge of the man, and/or the motives of your post.

No motive. Just trying to say I do not think from the reports in the arena or what I know of Walt and his background and his character that I do not see him checking out. I will eat crow if he tells me his heart was not in it. He was my son's roomate. I have watched him compete since he was a 5th grader. I have seen him blown out in 40 point games and I never saw him not go hard. NOt in his genes.

RSBobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/22/2010
Location: Columbus, OH
Post Count: 4,404

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/20/2013 11:57:44 PM

bornacatfan wrote:

RSBobcat wrote:

Question Walt's commitment, heart, soul, effort, etc. - and I gotta question your knowledge of the man, and/or the motives of your post.

Borna - that was not directed at you - your post was excellent. I have told Walt personally that he was one of my all time favorite Bobcats - for the reasons I listed for what others seemed to be questioning - all things that do not show up on stat lines.

RS Bobcat

bornacatfan
General User

Member Since: 8/3/2006
Post Count: 5,707

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 12:00:42 AM

RSBobcat wrote:

bornacatfan wrote:

RSBobcat wrote:

Question Walt's commitment, heart, soul, effort, etc. - and I gotta question your knowledge of the man, and/or the motives of your post.

Got it. I had a huge day today and just got back to the board. Was surprised to see what was up here.

Glad you took the time to tell Walt to his face. Will miss him and his P's in the Convo.

OhioCatFan
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 14,036

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 12:16:03 AM

My ONLY complaint about Walt is that I would have wished he would have learned in 4 years to keep his mouth guard in his mouth!

Last Edited: 3/21/2013 12:16:36 AM by OhioCatFan

LuckySparrow
General User

Member Since: 10/15/2012
Location: Illinois
Post Count: 1,723

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 12:49:01 AM

C Money wrote:

Bhugh24 wrote:

Great post.

Although my team fired Dusty in 2006.

What a day at the Convo.....Wow!

LuckySparrow
General User

Member Since: 10/15/2012
Location: Illinois
Post Count: 1,723

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 12:51:03 AM

Pataskala wrote:

CM, all you had to say is "Cubs fans." It's the anticipation, it's the watching, it's the enjoying, it's the highs, it's the lows, it's the memories.

Yup.

What a day at the Convo.....Wow!

Casper71
General User

Member Since: 12/1/2006
Post Count: 2,896

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 4:19:30 PM

I am not one to question walt or the posts on here. I think over the two years the guy was great. But, seriously he played 36 minutes with a bunch of goose eggs. He did NOT have those kinds of numbers in 60 + other games over the two years. And, you wonder why people might wonder about his dedication to that ONE SINGLE game?

On the other hand, as a coach, if my guy can't get an open lane or a shot of do I play him for 36 minutes? I think some should ask JC that question.

And, don't get pissed at me. I have stated i think JC was a good hire and I think Walt is a great guy. I hope they both use it as a "learning experience". Ain't that what college basketball is for 90+% of the participants? Incidentally, maybe we fans should use it as a learning experience too. After all, haven't any of you EVER gone to work and said screw it today...I'm just off?

OhioStunter
General User

Member Since: 2/18/2005
Location: Chicago
Post Count: 2,516

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 6:32:29 PM

I'm doing that right now.

Only one OHIO
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Avon, OH
Post Count: 148

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 8:36:28 PM

C Money wrote:

Well said. Post of the year nominee.

UpSan Bobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/30/2005
Location: Upper Sandusky, OH
Post Count: 3,795

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/21/2013 9:06:27 PM

Casper71 wrote:

On the other hand, as a coach, if my guy can't get an open lane or a shot of do I play him for 36 minutes? I think some should ask JC that question.

Who would he defer to? That was part of the problem down the stretch. We didn't have a consistent bench scorer. I do understand your point. Just kind of rationalizing why Walt played through a tough night. Like others, I feel bad that it ended that way for Walt and don't think it was due to a lack of effort.

impevan
General User

Member Since: 4/4/2012
Post Count: 9

Status: Offline

RE: Post article - Walt's comments

Posted: 3/22/2013 10:15:59 AM

amen, Bhugh24. very well said

Last Edited: 3/22/2013 10:17:56 AM by impevan

Showing Replies:	26 - 50 of 52 Posts
Jump to Page:	< Previous 1 \| 2 \| 3 Next >

View Other 'Ohio Basketball' Topics

There are 194 Active Visitors on BobcatAttack.com

192 Guests
2 Registered Users:
	colobobcat66, cbarber357

There are no other users looking at this page.