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OU declined (which I understand) but why wasn't a safety automatically called? The rules clearly state if the player in possession of the ball is still in the endzone during the holding infraction a safety is assessed. Am I missing something or did the refs clearly blow it which is highly probable since they are in fact MAC officials? Back to Top bigtillyoopsupsideurhead General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 1,926 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/22/2016 10:24:20 PM  I believe the holding call was on our NT up the middle so he was around the 1 yard line, not in the End Zone. Back to Top allen General User Member Since: 1/24/2006 Post Count: 4,635 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/22/2016 10:24:41 PM  OU812812 wrote: A holding call was made during Akron's next to last possession and the QB was in the endzone. OU declined (which I understand) but why wasn't a safety automatically called? The rules clearly state if the player in possession of the ball is still in the endzone during the holding infraction a safety is assessed. Am I missing something or did the refs clearly blow it which is highly probable since they are in fact MAC officials? true Nobody despises to lose more than I do. That's got me into trouble over the years, but it also made a man of mediocre ability into a pretty good coach. Woody Hayes Back to Top OU812812 General User Member Since: 11/22/2016 Post Count: 5 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/22/2016 10:29:12 PM  bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote: I believe the holding call was on our NT up the middle so he was around the 1 yard line, not in the End Zone. Maybe but right after the snap the QB looked to be in the endzone immediately. Typical MAC officials but I would also like to know why the coaches didn't raise hell over the call. Back to Top Mike Coleman Administrator Member Since: 12/21/2004 Location: Near the Pristine Sandy Shores of Lake Erie, OH Post Count: 1,611 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/22/2016 10:37:08 PM  OU812812 wrote: bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote: I believe the holding call was on our NT up the middle so he was around the 1 yard line, not in the End Zone. Maybe but right after the snap the QB looked to be in the endzone immediately. Typical MAC officials but I would also like to know why the coaches didn't raise hell over the call. Where was Tom McCabe when we needed him? Back to Top crackerbaby00 General User Member Since: 3/8/2007 Post Count: 442 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/22/2016 11:35:04 PM  I am pretty sure what matters is where the foul is committed, not where the QB is. Back to Top TWT General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Alexandria, VA Post Count: 5,112 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 12:33:35 AM  Mike Coleman wrote: OU812812 wrote: bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote: I believe the holding call was on our NT up the middle so he was around the 1 yard line, not in the End Zone. Maybe but right after the snap the QB looked to be in the endzone immediately. Typical MAC officials but I would also like to know why the coaches didn't raise hell over the call. Where was Tom McCabe when we needed him? McCabe is the missing piece of the puzzle. We've got the punter to pin the opposing team within the 5. Need McCabe's goal line judgement for better results. Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended 2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round 2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl 2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086 Back to Top GoCats105 General User Member Since: 1/31/2006 Location: Seattle, WA Post Count: 7,199 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 7:18:51 AM  crackerbaby00 wrote: I am pretty sure what matters is where the foul is committed, not where the QB is. This is what I thought too. Back to Top OhioCatFan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 14,388 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 11:35:02 AM  I may be wrong about this, but I think the question is where is the ball when the foul occurs. If the impetus for the ball being in the end zone is on the offense (which it was) and if the ball is still in the end zone when the infraction occurs, it's a safety. I'm not sure if the last qualification was met, but I think it was. The announcers seemed to think so, too. If I'm wrong about, I'm sure BTC will set me straight. The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA "It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right." Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org Back to Top Deciduous Forest Cat General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Ohio Post Count: 4,412 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 11:52:28 AM  I always thought the holding itself had to be in the end zone. Back to Top Bobcat110 General User Member Since: 3/5/2005 Location: Mount Gilead, OH Post Count: 705 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 11:52:50 AM  I was sitting in stands behind Ohio bench and wondered too, but saw no concern from coaches, so figured it must not have been a Safety. It looks like from the rule books that it's based on where the foul was committed, not where the ball was located. So, guess the ball can be in the endzone and a hold committed on the 1 yard line and that's not a safety. http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/FR17.pdf "Determining the Enforcement Spot and the Basic Spot ARTICLE 2. a. Dead-ball fouls. The enforcement spot for a foul committed when the ball is dead is the succeeding spot. b. Fouls by the offensive team behind the neutral zone. For the following fouls committed by the offensive team behind the neutral zone, the penalty is enforced at the previous spot: illegal use of hands, holding, illegal block and personal fouls (Exception: IF THE FOUL occurs in Team A’s end zone the penalty is a safety.). However, see Rule 6-3-13 for offensive team fouls during scrimmage kick plays." Last Edited: 11/23/2016 11:53:29 AM by Bobcat110 Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,470 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 12:02:09 PM  crackerbaby00 wrote: I am pretty sure what matters is where the foul is committed, not where the QB is. I'm pretty sure that the location that matters is where McCabe is located. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top BillyTheCat General User Member Since: 10/6/2012 Post Count: 10,064 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 12:38:47 PM  OhioCatFan wrote: I may be wrong about this, but I think the question is where is the ball when the foul occurs. If the impetus for the ball being in the end zone is on the offense (which it was) and if the ball is still in the end zone when the infraction occurs, it's a safety. I'm not sure if the last qualification was met, but I think it was. The announcers seemed to think so, too. If I'm wrong about, I'm sure BTC will set me straight. Yeah, you'd be wrong about this. What matters is where did the penalty occur and what is the spot of enforcement. Holding penalties on the offense are "spot" fouls when they occur beyond the line of scrimmage, and previous spot on fouls behind the LOS. On this play, the enforcement would be the previous spot. the position of the ball has zero bearing on this enforcement. Last Edited: 11/23/2016 12:44:28 PM by BillyTheCat Back to Top GoCats105 General User Member Since: 1/31/2006 Location: Seattle, WA Post Count: 7,199 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 1:48:16 PM  L.C. wrote: crackerbaby00 wrote: I am pretty sure what matters is where the foul is committed, not where the QB is. I'm pretty sure that the location that matters is where McCabe is located. Ok now that is funny. Back to Top GoCats105 General User Member Since: 1/31/2006 Location: Seattle, WA Post Count: 7,199 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 1:49:58 PM  BillyTheCat wrote: OhioCatFan wrote: I may be wrong about this, but I think the question is where is the ball when the foul occurs. If the impetus for the ball being in the end zone is on the offense (which it was) and if the ball is still in the end zone when the infraction occurs, it's a safety. I'm not sure if the last qualification was met, but I think it was. The announcers seemed to think so, too. If I'm wrong about, I'm sure BTC will set me straight. Yeah, you'd be wrong about this. What matters is where did the penalty occur and what is the spot of enforcement. Holding penalties on the offense are "spot" fouls when they occur beyond the line of scrimmage, and previous spot on fouls behind the LOS. On this play, the enforcement would be the previous spot. the position of the ball has zero bearing on this enforcement. So you're telling me that if the QB drops back 99 yards from the one to the opposite end zone, but the holding occurs at the 3 it's not a safety? THAT'S PURE POPPYCOCK! ;) Back to Top ytownbobcat General User Member Since: 8/7/2006 Post Count: 1,253 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 2:40:16 PM  It is a spot foul. From the point of the infraction. Back to Top OhioCatFan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 14,388 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 3:35:01 PM  Thanks, BTC, I stand corrected. The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA "It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right." Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org Back to Top Pete Chouteau General User Member Since: 11/17/2004 Location: You Can't See Me Post Count: 1,639 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 3:46:01 PM  Not unless they call intentional grounding. Back to Top BillyTheCat General User Member Since: 10/6/2012 Post Count: 10,064 Status: Offline     RE: Why no safety?    Posted: 11/23/2016 6:49:11 PM  ytownbobcat wrote: It is a spot foul. From the point of the infraction. Not in the NCAA "Fouls by Team A behind the neutral zone. For the following fouls committed by Team A behind the neutral zone, the penalty is enforced at the previous spot: illegal use of hands, holding, illegal block and personal foul (Exception: If the foul occurs in Team A’s end zone the penalty is a safety). However, see Rule 6-3-13 for kicking team fouls during scrimmage kick plays." 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