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Topic: That CMU finish

Topic: That CMU finish

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cbarber357
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That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 3:47:38 PM

Crazy

bornacatfan
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 3:48:33 PM

Just the way to close out. Love the comeback and the decision

never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Winter comes and asks how you spent your summer.....

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Mike Johnson
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 4:59:28 PM

bornacatfan wrote:

Just the way to close out. Love the comeback and the decision

Hated the decision. To me, the Chips - after that genuinely miraculous comeback - deserved a 50-50 chance to win in OT.

At all levels of football, 2-pt tries succeed only about 30%.

http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author

OhioCatFan
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 5:18:09 PM

Mike Johnson wrote:

bornacatfan wrote:

Just the way to close out. Love the comeback and the decision

Hated the decision. To me, the Chips - after that genuinely miraculous comeback - deserved a 50-50 chance to win in OT.

At all levels of football, 2-pt tries succeed only about 30%.

+1 This reminded me of Frank's decision to go for two at Marshall. I hated before and after the decision. Of course, if the result had been different in each case I would have changed my mind.;-)

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L.C.
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 5:47:06 PM

Mike Johnson wrote:

Hated the decision. To me, the Chips - after that genuinely miraculous comeback - deserved a 50-50 chance to win in OT.

At all levels of football, 2-pt tries succeed only about 30%.

I hated the decision, too, but keep in mind that Enos knows his team, and he knew their state, physically and mentally, and that goes into the decision, and that's why I hesitate to 2d guess the coach in that situation. To me it was the wrong call because his team had the momentum, and you'd think they would be the favorite in OT. On the other hand, if that comeback had left them emotionally and physically spent, perhaps going for 2 was the better call.

In the NTSU case, Ohio was on the road, and in bad weather (if I recall correctly), both of which probably favored NTSU in overtime.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

The Optimist
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 8:09:04 PM

Love the decision. Hate the playcall.

Going for two in this situation is the right call. Across the board, coaches don't go for two enough. Not enough guts out there to make the logical decision these days. So much softness.

I've seen crazier things happen.

perimeterpost
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 8:13:06 PM

wasn't going for 2 at N Texas a defining moment for our program? I like the call.

MY STATE. MY TEAM.

TheBobcatBandit
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 9:32:46 PM

Yeah going to OT in my mind kinda stems the momentum. That play call was terrible. Would've liked to see the Statue of Liberty there.

Pataskala
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/24/2014 10:17:57 PM

I turned it on when it was 49-28 with about five minutes to go. Never thought they had a chance, especially when they were taking so much time to run plays on that first drive. The only thing missing on that last play was the Stanford band.

I hated the decision too. CMU's defense forced three-and-outs twice in the last three minutes. I would've taken it to OT and put my trust in the defense.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

UpSan Bobcat
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:00:27 AM

Most of the time, it's not hard to get 3 yards, but when the defense knows you are going for 3 yards (only have to defend small area), it's much harder. If 2-point conversions were such a good idea, coaches would go for them every time.

BillyTheCat
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:10:03 AM

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

Yeah going to OT in my mind kinda stems the momentum. That play call was terrible. Would've liked to see the Statue of Liberty there.

I hope that is sarcasm.

Pataskala
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:33:38 AM

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

And they wouldn't be worth twice as much as a kick.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 12:41:42 PM

VERY VANILLA play call on the 2-point try. Apparently they consulted the OHIO play book on that. A whole staff of coaches full time year round--and that's the best they had?

Unprepared.

That looked like a team that hadn't beaten a winning record MAC team or won a MACC in forever.

Bad call. Very bad call.

Did the coaches all turn to each other and ask, "who's got a really bland, mediocre play that's not surprising in any way and that's not particularly geared to work?"

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!

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oldkatz
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 12:55:46 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Do you have an employee named Bob Crachett, Mo????

"All my inside sources tell me I have no inside sources." Salvatore "money bucks" Mafiosiano.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 4:10:20 PM

I am happy to provide public service

UpSan Bobcat
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 8:16:14 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

I don't think throwing a jump ball for a 6-3 receiver one-on-one against a 5-10 corner is such a bad play call, even if the corner's name is Wonderful Terry.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:08:13 PM

That is a great name. But the play is tired, unoriginal and carries no deception, doesn,t put the D off balance in any way.

Not good call.

TheBobcatBandit
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:55:05 PM

BillyTheCat wrote:

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

Yeah going to OT in my mind kinda stems the momentum. That play call was terrible. Would've liked to see the Statue of Liberty there.

I hope that is sarcasm.

I mean at that point why not? Worked for Boise in the same situation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6Wfg0n2EE8

Last Edited: 12/25/2014 10:58:09 PM by TheBobcatBandit

L.C.
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/26/2014 4:51:09 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

This thread is an interesting reminder that plays should only be viewed in the retrospective, and that any play that didn't work was a bad play call while any play that did work was a great call. The reminder comes from the fact that not so long ago, after Florida State used it effectively a year ago, we had a thread dedicated to Ohio's need for really tall receivers so that we can execute this very same play.
http://www.bobcatattack.com/messageboard/topic.asp?FromPa...
Since it won a game for Florida State, it was effective and necessary. Since it lost a game for CMU, it was tired, boring, bland, not particularly geared to work, etc.

Myself, I'd rather guess that execution had something to do with play success or failure. Even when you are trying to take advantage of a 6-3 receiver against a 5-10 defender, the QB still needs to put the ball on the correct side of the receiver, so that the receiver has a better play on the ball than the defender.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/26/2014 9:26:20 PM

Disagree. I analyze calls significantly for what they are irrespective of success.

So, OUr failure to use two-back sets: abominable.

The play where qb goes down the line as if calling a set to guys on one side of center--then, while he's doing this, there's a direct snap to the running back who walks into the endzone--brilliant!

Too bad OUr side has so very few imaginative calls each year.

Still don't understand lining up Basham at left end when all his damage seems done at right end.

L.C.
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/27/2014 11:02:43 AM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Disagree. I analyze calls significantly for what they are irrespective of success....

That's certainly possible, Monroe, but I can only go based on what is posted here, and draw conclusions from that, and from what is not posted. I have only seen praise for plays that worked, and criticism of plays that didn't. I have never seen criticism of plays that worked, nor praise for plays that didn't work, and that isn't just from you, it's a universal phenomenon.

The other thing that seems significantly absent from the running commentary on play calling is any sort of analysis of the defensive alignment. Obviously there is no way to know if a play is a good or bad call without knowing what defense the other team is in, and their tendencies. What might be a good call in one instance would be a terrible call in another.

For example, the play that you mention, the direct snap to AJ worked primarily because of the defense the other team was in, and not because of deception, though the deception helped. As I recall, Ohio was lined up with 4 wide receivers, so the defense had only 5-6 players in the box. If Ohio called the same play with 8 defenders in the box, obviously it would fail.

In the case of CMU's call, I didn't like the decision to go for 2, since they had the momentum, and since it was on a neutral field, but I did like the play call. They lined up and snapped quickly. They got the exactly the matchup they wanted, one on one, their tall WR against a short DB. All the QB needed to do was put the ball up where the WR could take it away from the DB, just as he had on the long TD the play before. Even when you have a good play, poor execution spoils everything. The QB needed to throw the ball either directly to the receiver, or to his right, giving him a better than even chance of making the catch, but instead, he threw it to the receiver's left, right where the DB was. The result was that the defender had an easy pass breakup, and the receiver couldn't even jump for the ball. I like the call, I hate the execution.

Last Edited: 12/27/2014 11:05:31 AM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

OhioCatFan
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/27/2014 2:17:55 PM

Am I the only one who thought the DB mugged the intended receiver on that play? I didn't notice it so much in real time, but on the replay it seem to me that there was clear early and significant contact. Over the years I've noted a general tendency of refs to be very reluctant to call interference on these types of crucial plays at the end of a game. It seems that the defense can get away will all sorts of shenanigans in these situations that wouldn't be tolerated at other points in the game. Remember the two-point conversion attempt against Marshall a few years ago? Many of us thought the intended receiver was tripped, but no flag was flown. Last year Akron had a fourth and goal at the Michigan one with seconds to go in the game; their QB threw a potentially winning pass into the endzone in which the intended receiver was interfered with, as several of the announcers said at the time, but again no flag. I think that this tendency of officials to keep flags in their pockets in these situations, together with the fact that your odds are not as good on a two point conversation, make these decisions questionable in nearly all situations. Of course, if you call it and are successful, it's a brilliant and gutsy call. Like, Frank, at N. Texas a few years ago.

Deciduous Forest Cat
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/27/2014 3:03:53 PM

I wouldn't say mugged but there was certainly enough arm grabbing to warrant a flag there. They should have gotten another crack there. Then they could have run the uber creative double reverse flea flicker statute of liberty hook n ladder that Monroe thinks is appropriate in every situation

Last Edited: 12/27/2014 3:04:28 PM by Deciduous Forest Cat

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/27/2014 6:35:54 PM

When we won'd the Potato Bowl, wasn't the clinching td scored on a rollout such that TT could have passed or run. We gave ourselves options.

CMU didn't.

Seriously, I can't keep doing this for you..I have Importatnt Stuff to do.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: That CMU finish

Posted: 12/27/2014 6:36:22 PM

L.C. wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Disagree. I analyze calls significantly for what they are irrespective of success....

I could not disagree more. That play worked because we had a HUGE ADVANTAGE FOR A MOMENT...a moment long enough to get into the endzone.

Compare: During the Brown's Kardiac Kids days of success, bars throughout Southern California were loaded on Sunday morning with Browns fans (pre-'net home video) when they showed Browns games.

On one play, Kosar handed off to a running back for a dive up the middle--no, the rb turned back toward Kosar--at which point one of your favorite people beat everyone else to their feet and yelled TOUCHDOWN!--and ptiched the ball back to Kosar who tossed to a wide open receiver for a long td.

The conception of the play gave the Browns a huge momentary advantage--which meant an easy six. It was a td from the moment the rb stopped going forward and began to turn back to Kosar. It was the conception of the play--the surprise element--and the odds of any defense on earth stopping the play were extremely low.

Sometimes, there are great calls.

I know it's difficult for fans of OHIO FOOTBALL to understand that given the situation. the situation.

SCBBA...SoCalBrownsBackersAssn...what a boon to bars which were otherwise closed on Sunday mornings. If the Browns won/were winning a game, the food and drink orders were bountiful. On the above-described td, everyone jumped up and screamed--and the temperature of the bar that I was in IMMEDIATELY went up about seven degrees.

Last Edited: 12/27/2014 6:51:03 PM by Monroe Slavin

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