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Ohio Football
Topic:  Perspective

Topic:  Perspective
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Pete Chouteau
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  Message Not Read  Perspective
   Posted: 10/4/2014 10:39:51 PM 
Ohio, despite the loss to Central Michigan, still controls its own destiny in the MAC East.
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DublinCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/4/2014 11:22:03 PM 
Well, by comparison it looks like our "D" is more than twice as good as that of South Carolina

OU87

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Casper71
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/4/2014 11:28:27 PM 
God, I hate this reasoning. of course we control our own destiny. We've only played two league games and by that reasoning everyone is in the hunt right now. But my God, who would pick us after the performance today?
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bobcatsquared
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/5/2014 8:46:57 AM 
Every team in America controlled its own destiny only a month ago.
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Diamond Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/5/2014 9:03:21 AM 
Wish I shared your positive outlook Pete. It was tough to watch this team yesterday. As I wait for my coffee to wake me up on this Sunday, I just cannot find the same excitement for Homecoming Week that I had in years past.

I thought I remembered seeing a stat at or around halftime that indicated we had 3 yards passing? Man.

It just seems we are putting together teams that can beat the directional schools we play in September along with 3-4 bad MAC Teams. All of this logic limps us into a Bowl Game and somehow that should be success? No thanks.

BTW - we may be one of the 3-4 bad MAC Teams right now. Please don't take me back to the 80's (at least not for Ohio Football)!
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LuckySparrow
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Member Since: 10/15/2012
Location: Illinois
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/5/2014 12:05:02 PM 
Sprague was 2-12 for 3 yds passing at halftime.

What a day at the Convo.....Wow!

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Monroe Slavin
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Location: Oxnard, CA
Post Count: 9,121

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/5/2014 1:48:45 PM 
Perspective is important:

We are not competitive with even the middle-of-the-MAC teams and have not been for a long while.

Do I really need to watch the 1 minute 25 second video recap by Coach of yesterday's game and get so much sub-average such as:

'We learned lessons today.' Oh, we haven't learned them from the last 25 games? So what; we'll clearly not incorporate those lessons into what we do. We'll clearly do nothing different at all. But expect different results.

'We're clearly having trouble defensing the pass.' Thanks; no one knew that. Again, will we react to circumstances. (I like Devin Bass. Last year you could see how hard he competes. That doesn't seem to have changed. Get him some help some how. Change things.)

'CMU ran two back sets and a one back power set' which caused us problems, made it difficult for us. They also passed for a ton on us--don't forget that. Really--you're going to tell us that they varied their offense some yet despite so many of us here seeing the obvious and pleading for such as two back sets and more power at the goal line, well, nothing...we just keep with the same old stuff that works against less-than-cream-of-the-crop-FCS schools and no one else.

1:25 of video...yet it shows so much of what is wrong.

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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L.C.
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Member Since: 8/31/2005
Location: United States
Post Count: 10,494

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 10:55:39 AM 
Pete Chouteau wrote:
Ohio, despite the loss to Central Michigan, still controls its own destiny in the MAC East.

Here's my perspective. So far this season Ohio has won exactly the games I expect them to win, and lost exactly the games I expected them to lose. I didn't expect them to win the MAC East this year, and I still don't. My hope for the season was that the team would play hard, and continue to improve as the year went on, winning more games towards the end of the season and becoming bowl eligible.

Like everyone else, I wasn't impressed by the results at CMU. I didn't see any sign that the team quit, however, and I did see them continuing to try to improve. I guess I see two steps forward, and one step back. Now it's time to go forward again. The team needs 3 more wins to become bowl eligible again, and 4 probably to get to a bowl. I think they can still accomplish that.

In the preseason picks, there are four people who have picked all 6 of the first six games correctly. All four of them have picked Ohio to win at least 6 games for the season. Buffalo and Miami look like the most likely wins, but BG would be a nice start.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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BillyTheCat
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Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 10,391

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 10:57:35 AM 
L.C. wrote:
Pete Chouteau wrote:
Ohio, despite the loss to Central Michigan, still controls its own destiny in the MAC East.

Here's my perspective. So far this season Ohio has won exactly the games I expect them to win, and lost exactly the games I expected them to lose. I didn't expect them to win the MAC East this year, and I still don't. My hope for the season was that the team would play hard, and continue to improve as the year went on, winning more games towards the end of the season and becoming bowl eligible.

Like everyone else, I wasn't impressed by the results at CMU. I didn't see any sign that the team quit, however, and I did see them continuing to try to improve. I guess I see two steps forward, and one step back. Now it's time to go forward again. The team needs 3 more wins to become bowl eligible again, and 4 probably to get to a bowl. I think they can still accomplish that.

In the preseason picks, there are four people who have picked all 6 of the first six games correctly. All four of them have picked Ohio to win at least 6 games for the season. Buffalo and Miami look like the most likely wins, but BG would be a nice start.


+1, these kids are still working hard, they are a young and talented group. Not giving up on them or the coaches!
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sargentfan
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Member Since: 3/16/2005
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 11:43:19 AM 
I hope the team will improve, but as of right now we have not beat any good teams. Until we beat a good team I would have to say I'll be pessimistic for the rest of our games. We should still win 5 or 6 games, but that won't be enough for us to make a bowl game this year, without any kind of signature win. Personally I pin all our hopes on AJ, if he can get healthy and be a beast we can probably get to 7 or 8 wins, but won't win the MAC East.
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Pataskala
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Location: At least six feet away from anybody else
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 12:10:12 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
God, I hate this reasoning. of course we control our own destiny. We've only played two league games and by that reasoning everyone is in the hunt right now. But my God, who would pick us after the performance today?


That's not the case for EMU. Toledo's 3-0, EMU's 0-2 including a loss to Toledo. EMU would need lots of help to win the MAC West. Of course, they need lots of help just to find the field on game day.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.
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Casper71
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Member Since: 12/1/2006
Post Count: 3,090

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 12:20:24 PM 
Great, now we are one game better off than EMU. Seriously?
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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 12:23:22 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
Great, now we are one game better off than EMU. Seriously?


We were one game better than they were before Saturday, so nothing's changed in that regard.

And I erred. EMU is only 0-1 and they haven't played Toledo. So EMU -- IN THEORY -- controls its own destiny.

Last Edited: 10/6/2014 12:27:04 PM by Pataskala

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.
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Casper71
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Post Count: 3,090

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 1:52:40 PM 
And, in closing...my guess is that from the early years of the solich era to the top 25 ranking and talk of the next Boise State in 2012 this program was on the rise and may have gotten as "high" as it can get. I just feel that since the 2012 season this program has been on a steady decline. That's my perspective on things today:) Maybe the Cats will change that perspective after Homecomming!
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Monroe Slavin
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Location: Oxnard, CA
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/6/2014 7:24:49 PM 
My perspective is that we got absolutely drilled by CMU. It wasn't just a loss in which we played reasonably well.

So, no, I can't just regard it as 'a game that most expected us to lose and, so, we're about where we expected to be, and, so we're okay.'

We got manhandled embarrassed. They did what they wanted and we couldn't stop it. They knew what we obvious wanted to do and they totally shut it down.

Anyone who could watch our offense, our play-calling and our defensive performance the other day along with the last 25 games and not be concerned--well, I don't think they're grasping reality.

First, no one on these threads has answered my very specific criticisms/questions about our offense (see the 'We albin' thread) and our defense (I think I delineated that in the 'Perspective' thread). Until someone does, I'm not convinced.

Second, we'll see how we do this Saturday.



Minus 2 yards in three tries from first and goal at their six. Three plays we needed to punch it in from their two foot line Great offense.

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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OhioCatFan
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Location: Athens, OH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/7/2014 7:01:16 PM 
Remember old Rich Rod at UMich? He gotten beaten bad by many not so great teams, and even lost to Toledo. Michigan fans said he was a horrible coach; that's before they saw Hoke the Joke. Don't look now but his Arizona team is 5-0 and ranked 10th in the AP poll. Would Michigan have been better off to give Rodriguez a few more years rather than hire Hoke? My point: Frank's in a rebuilding year. Tossing him now would be the height of stupidity! (fist symbol)

Edit to make correction on Appy State.

Last Edited: 10/7/2014 7:29:44 PM by OhioCatFan

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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GoCats105
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Member Since: 1/31/2006
Location: Seattle, WA
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/7/2014 7:10:52 PM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
Remember old Rich Rod at UMich? He gotten beaten bad by many not so great teams, and even lost to Toledo and Appy State. Michigan fans said he was a horrible coach; that's before they saw Hoke the Joke. Don't look now but his Arizona team is 5-0 and ranked 10th in the AP poll. Would Michigan have been better off to give Rodriguez a few more years rather than hire Hoke? My point: Frank's in a rebuilding year. Tossing him now would be the height of stupidity! (fist symbol)


This analogy is so far off base. It was Lloyd Carr who lost to App. State. And RichRod never got the support from the administration to succeed at a high level at Michigan aka he wasn't a "Michigan" guy. His offense was great, but he could never implement a strong enough defense. He was constantly in rebuilding mode because players kept leaving and the AD didn't want him because they weren't satisfied with direction they were going. Frank has always had full support of the AD at Ohio.
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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/7/2014 7:33:07 PM 
GoCats105 wrote:
This analogy is so far off base. It was Lloyd Carr who lost to App. State. And RichRod never got the support from the administration to succeed at a high level at Michigan aka he wasn't a "Michigan" guy. His offense was great, but he could never implement a strong enough defense. He was constantly in rebuilding mode because players kept leaving and the AD didn't want him because they weren't satisfied with direction they were going. Frank has always had full support of the AD at Ohio.


You are correct about Appy State and I corrected my original post based on your input. However, I think that my analogy is on target. If he had been winning in those early years, they wouldn't have cared if he was a "Michigan man" or not. That was more a pretext than a real reason. If they had had more patience, I think RichRod would have eventually won at Michigan as he is now doing at Arizona. Over the years, I've seen this scenario a number of times, where an administration with a little more patience -- and the ability to fend off or ignore a loud but ignorant fanbase -- was rewarded in the end for not pulling the plug too soon. Admittedly that's harder, but not impossible to do, at a place like Michigan compared to OHIO.

Last Edited: 10/7/2014 7:37:11 PM by OhioCatFan

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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ou79
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/7/2014 11:20:45 PM 
Here is my concern. We are now in year 10 of Frank & Co. and we have not won a MAC title in those ten years. How long is long enough and please don't tell me about our past prior to Frank. I have been following the Bobcats since the late 60's so I am well aware of our history. My question again is how long do we wait?
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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 12:47:17 AM 
So, all would be wonderful if we'd just held on to the 20-0 lead in the second half of the MACC game against NIU? I was there, and it was one of the most miserable experiences of my OHIO fan life, but you know we came very, very close to that MACC. I'm not going to hang Frank for one FG by NIU. And, I feel that he'll bring us back to the MACC again in the next two years. And, I'd put up even money that the next time we win it. GO OHIO!

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 12:56:48 AM 
ou79 wrote:
Here is my concern. We are now in year 10 of Frank & Co. and we have not won a MAC title in those ten years. How long is long enough and please don't tell me about our past prior to Frank. I have been following the Bobcats since the late 60's so I am well aware of our history. My question again is how long do we wait?


Bingo.

The problem is with the way that we lost that MACC to NIU...too emblematic of the current coaching: way too conservative way too soon..couldn't recognize what was happening or adjust to stop it. Very typical of us.

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Pets On The Go Collection of pet gear travel bags
The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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GoCats105
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 8:26:50 AM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
GoCats105 wrote:
This analogy is so far off base. It was Lloyd Carr who lost to App. State. And RichRod never got the support from the administration to succeed at a high level at Michigan aka he wasn't a "Michigan" guy. His offense was great, but he could never implement a strong enough defense. He was constantly in rebuilding mode because players kept leaving and the AD didn't want him because they weren't satisfied with direction they were going. Frank has always had full support of the AD at Ohio.


You are correct about Appy State and I corrected my original post based on your input. However, I think that my analogy is on target. If he had been winning in those early years, they wouldn't have cared if he was a "Michigan man" or not. That was more a pretext than a real reason. If they had had more patience, I think RichRod would have eventually won at Michigan as he is now doing at Arizona. Over the years, I've seen this scenario a number of times, where an administration with a little more patience -- and the ability to fend off or ignore a loud but ignorant fanbase -- was rewarded in the end for not pulling the plug too soon. Admittedly that's harder, but not impossible to do, at a place like Michigan compared to OHIO.


I'll agree that RichRod probably would have succeeded had the AD been more patient and put all of their eggs into his collective basket. However, I still don't think that applies to Ohio. Frank has been at Ohio for 10 years. RichRod was at Michigan for three. It's a totally different scenario.
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GoCats105
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Location: Seattle, WA
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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 8:29:11 AM 
ou79 wrote:
Here is my concern. We are now in year 10 of Frank & Co. and we have not won a MAC title in those ten years. How long is long enough and please don't tell me about our past prior to Frank. I have been following the Bobcats since the late 60's so I am well aware of our history. My question again is how long do we wait?


Exactly.

And for the record, I still don't think I've read anywhere on this board that says Frank should be let go immediately. Some have said we can see the turn for the worse the program has taken and the end might be near, or that Frank needs to make some changes in house to turn things around. I have no question that Frank would be a great coach to lead Ohio to its first MAC title, but if he is unwilling to make the changes necessary to get there, like ou79 has pointed out, how long does Ohio wait?
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Bcat2
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Member Since: 7/6/2010
Post Count: 4,295

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  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 10:11:27 AM 
ou79 wrote:
Here is my concern. We are now in year 10 of Frank & Co. and we have not won a MAC title in those ten years. How long is long enough and please don't tell me about our past prior to Frank. I have been following the Bobcats since the late 60's so I am well aware of our history. My question again is how long do we wait?


Well, Nebraska's last conf title was 99 with coach Solich. They let him go and two coaches later are still wondering the same thing.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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Monroe Slavin
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Oxnard, CA
Post Count: 9,121

Status: Offline
  Message Not Read  RE: Perspective
   Posted: 10/8/2014 10:22:06 AM 
Seriously, you'd keep someone on who (whom?) you were dissatisfied with just for fear that the next person could be worse?

In business that will kill you.

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Pets On The Go Collection of pet gear travel bags
The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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