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Topic: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Topic: Fact: We Were Out Coached

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HeHateMiami
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Mason, OH
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Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/2/2011 10:58:37 PM

We played not to lose. Missed TD catch, missed FG, whatever. Our coaching staff changed the gameplan up 20-0 and managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Mistakes Are understandable. Pathetic decision making is not.

bostonbobcat
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Location: East Bridgewater, MA
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/2/2011 11:01:34 PM

That would require Doeren having done something of substance. Solich and staff simply threw up all over themselves.

Casper71
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/2/2011 11:06:16 PM

Seriously...our veteran staff, as many have noted, in the second half didn't play to win. How can a 60+ year old veteran HC let the staff approach the second half that way? And the NIU guy was in his first year.

I'm just disappointed all around.

ayfkm
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Member Since: 9/25/2010
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 12:56:28 AM

The "turtle shell offense". Get a lead, hide in your shell, watch the game slip away. Pure Frank.

OhioStunter
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Location: Chicago
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 1:12:00 AM

I'm certainly not going to defend the coaching tonight, but a lot of this criticism is around conservative offensive play-calling in the second half, yet when they call plays similar to what they started the game with (deep pass over the middle), it leads to more criticism. It can't be both ways.

Yes, the timing of the deep pass call with 8 min to go was not ideal. But the biggest reason for tonight's loss was a series of mistakes from BOTH the players AND coaches. Mistakes by BOTH teams. NIU coaching wasn't that great. Deciding to punt from the 40 down 13 with 10 minutes to go? Our coaches should have made better second-half adjustments, like not putting LBs on WRs, but the coaching was just as bad on the other sideline.

This was not an impressive conference championship game to showcase to a national audience.

In fact, it was embarrassing.

Cats-22
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 5:38:13 AM

Certainly the coaching could have been better but most of the "conservative playcallling" criticism is off-base. Ohio had 17 rushes and 12 pass plays in the second half, by my count. That's not a turtle shell.

The problem in the second half was getting sacked for a 13 yard loss on 3rd and 3 and other failures in the passing game (an INT when passing on first down, only four completions the whole 2nd half) while being unable to move the ball in the running game all that well, either.

The Ohio coaches didn't out-scheme NIU in the second half (obviously) but I wouldn't say coaching was really the difference, either. NIU made several outstanding offensive plays in the second half, and Ohio didn't. Overall both teams did things well at some point in the game, it's just that all of Ohio's positives were in the first half, and all of NIU's positives were in the second half. A strange game in that respect, and a tough loss, but not the end of the world. On to the next one.

Bobcat Grad 86
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 8:23:48 AM

I like Donte Harden and I agree he is our most talented running back. Donte, also ran very hard last night and I have no questions about his effort last night. But somebody please explain to me no carries by Boykin or Blankenship?

Donte has been playing with a bad hamstring and I would think healthy or dinged up, a change of pace by mixing in Boykin and/or BB could have helped.

How come we only threw one time to Riley in the second half which was caught for nine yards? He has great hands and a few short passes underneath the coverage with some deep routes by LB could have mixed things up a bit, and also run the clock with short pass completions that don't stop the clock.

Bcat2
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 8:41:07 AM

Bobcat Grad 86 wrote:

Credit to NIU. In the second half first downs became rare. A certain DE began owning our best OT. I am sure TT would have loved to have thrown it to Riley, heck, everyone, but, credit to NIU.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 11:12:44 AM

LOOKIT ANYONE WHO DOES NOT THINK THAT THIS LOSS FALLS ON THE 2ND HALF COACHING SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO POST. Yes, our players did some things wrong. NIU's players probably did more things wrong (penalties, turnovers, dropped passes).

BUT THE DIFFERENCE WAS OUR SCARED. CONTRAST OUR LOCKED-DOWN, CONTINUOUS, RUNS UP THE MIDDLE FOR NO PARTICULAR GAIN AT ALL IN YESTERDAY'S SECOND HALF WITH THE FULL DISPLAY OF OUR OFFENSE ON THE FINAL 7+ MINUTE DRIVE AGAINST BG. BASICALLY, WE WENT TWO-MINUTE VICTORY FORMATION WITH 30 MINUTES LEFT IN THE GAME YESTERDAY...AND TOOK THE OBVIOUS RESULT.

MIGHT HAVE HELPED TO BLITZ HARNISH MORE THAN ONCE ALSO.

Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!

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giacomo
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 11:21:51 AM

NIU sure as heck tried to give us the game last night and we dropped it like a hot potato. I don't blame the loss on any one thing or even on Solich. He isn't out there playing. I didn't like us sitting back before the half. If ever there was a time to throw it downfield, that would have been it, up 20 and if we make a mistake it's down at their end and not enough time for them to score. You knew NIU would make some plays in the second half. They are too good not to, and they sure did. The interception at the 8+ minute mark was bad. I know Solich thought it would finish them off if we make that play, instead it finishes us off. I don't know that I want Tettleton throwing downfield too much, as he is a runner first, IMO and would like to see him with a mix of short stuff and runs. But I'm not the coach. It kind of reminds me of the OSU loss a few years ago in Columbus. All we really had to do was make a few plays in the second half and we win. In both cases we don't. Congrats on a good season.

Bogey5
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 11:22:41 AM

Sorry Monroe, consider me an outcast of your posting dictatorship.

I was clearly rooting for OU and had some money on the bobcats as well so I was in your corner. However, being a bit more objective than the hardcore OU fan, I believe you lost because you didn't make plays when you needed too. I liked OU taking some late shots down the field because NIU was clearly geared to stop the run. Had TT completed one for a long TD the bulk of you would cheered that great call with gusto.

Just my take....

Bogey5
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 11:25:09 AM

Perhaps you were in the pisser when TT took a few shots down the field in the 3rd and 4th quarter,. Your post is absurd.

Cat4ever
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Location: Oakland, FL
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 11:38:07 AM

Bcat2 wrote:

Credit to NIU. In the second half first downs became rare. A certain DE began owning our best OT. I am sure TT would have loved to have thrown it to Riley, heck, everyone, but, credit to NIU.

BC2, what are you doing posting here?! Don't you know, unless you are on a mission to defame OUr coaching staff, you are at the wrong place? This string is strictly for couch-potato coaches taking a break from their fantasy football leagues!

The only thing that is a fact is that nothing is a fact.
If this statement is true, it is also false.
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Monroe Slavin
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 12:14:12 PM

I'm certainly in favor of more runs by non-power running backs right up the gut for no yardage at all.

However I have conditions for such calls.

First, this play is best called after we repeatedly prove that it doesn't gain more than a yard and a half.

Second, we have to call this play almost exclusively, ignoring our excellent short and mid-range passing game.

Third, we have to do it with little deception. Just a straight ahead run with not much dazzle or faking.

Fourth, we have to do it more and more when it's not working and when we need to grind out some clock by getting first downs.

Fifth, we have to do it out of a one back set. We should never think of going to a two back look. Because that would be so different from what we usually do. (Different is bad. Don't we all regret going to the hurry -up this year.) This different look might give us a momentary advantage over the defense...like, for instance, when we had first and goal at about the four in the third quarter. Momentary advantage could yield a moderately big play (such as a four yard gain at first and goal from the four). So, this must be avoided.

SIxth, don't pass to the tight end when we are in a 2nd or 3rd and short yardage; stick to the non-power running up the middle for 1.5 yards.

In a game of teams that are quite evenly matched, I feel that coaching and the mental approach can give us an advantage. But this is the holiday season. The season of giving. Let's give them a steady dose of nothing runs up the middle.

So, we can give them the ultimate gift. Championships wrapped in a bow.

El Gato Roberto
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 1:26:15 PM

Bogey5 wrote:

Yeah, you can mark me for sorting, too. Good call...3 yards longer and it's 6 and most likely "game over". Gutsy call...didn't work this time.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 1:50:07 PM

I have no problem with the interception on the long ball to LaVon that was intercepted. He was well open, with the ball underthrown.

My grudge is the nothing running plays up the middle, the timidity and abandonment of our identity in the second half. Never seen a team go into FETAL POSITION protection of a lead mode with 30 minutes to play.

OhioStunter
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 3:45:44 PM

The second-half play-calling was evenly balanced. 14 run plays, 13 pass plays called.

This was a complete second-half breakdown at all levels. Execution of the running and passing games. Mistakes at the special teams levels (12-yard punts, missed FG, bad kick-off coverage). Defensive mismatches (LBs on WRs).

It plays a part, but you can't pin this all on coaching.

Last Edited: 12/3/2011 3:52:28 PM by OhioStunter

T-Rodge
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 4:13:25 PM

I'd say 80% coaching and 20% players. Yeah, we were balanced in the 2nd half. But the plays were way too conservative, ie run up the middle for no gain. We didnt throw in any misdirection and Phil Bates was no-where to been seen n the 2nd half. He had one play and he threw a TD!!! Put him back in and let him do it again in the 2nd half! But no, instead we got so vanilla that it made me sick. Why take OUr foot off the gas at half time? We should have buried them and their chances. No Killer Instinct. Ex- not taking a timeout to stop the clock at the end at the 1st half. We had them on the ropes big time! We prolly could have gotten at least 3pts, but no, b/c Our staff thought the game was over at the half. How could we possibly believe 20pts was enough to win this game? The proof is there; 20pts 1st half- 0 pts 2nd half.

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MonroeClassmate
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/3/2011 4:54:08 PM

Just back from Detroit. Band awesome as usual--had the locals coming over to boogie with the band--neat!

NI great catches, incredible interceptions, good tackling, accurate 4th quarter passing, good pressure on QB--NI has better skill players. NI loses two stars on defense and NI doesn't miss a beat. Sitting next to the band was where 70% of the scoring action took place and you could see the NI athletes make great plays on the ball, adjustments in routes--these receivers made their QB look so good in 4q.

Coaches--major screw up was that after the tie, should have played for overtime and not thrown--take the chances in OT. That is the coaching mistake. One run and two incompletes! Defense coaching bad was not figuring out that jet sweep it got 7 or more seemingly every time they ran it.

To anyone who ever posted something negative about Phil Bates you should be ashamed. He stands back there like a statute, fearless at the oncoming rush (no happy feet) and throws the best pass of the game by the three who threw a pass.

Last Edited: 12/3/2011 4:55:20 PM by MonroeClassmate

NIU007b
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/4/2011 2:35:40 AM

Ugly game. I think both teams put pressure on themselves due to past history in MACC games, and it showed. For NIU in the first half, and Ohio in the 2nd half, once the momentum started to turn. Tettleton's a good QB and he's only a sophomore so he has 2 years to get back to the MACC. Teams that do well against NIU tend to be very efficient in the short passing game, and Ohio was doing that at first, but not later in the game. Not sure what changed. I'm not surprised they decided to throw a bomb on 1st down with 8:55 left to play - NIU was trying to stop the run, and had stopped Ohio already, until the dumb offsides penalty on the punt. The WR was open, the ball was just underthrown. I'm sure they felt they couldn't afford to be that conservative and still sustain a drive. Anyway, that's my take on it, FWIW.

Ohio's been consistently pretty good, I'm sure they'll end up back in the MACC before long.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/4/2011 4:26:15 AM

More than any specific play-calling or strategy, what I think bothers me most is the tone deafness. Now I know that TV highlights things. So, maybe it wasn't too many guys on our sidelines who were sitting down and looking stunned. But the camera caught quite a few of our players looking that way.

Someone--one of the captains or coaches--should have tried to get everyone together for a re-grouping of concentration. We should literally have called a timeout r(egardless of the game situation and clock) to shake ourselves out of the funk.

Did the coaches and captains miss that the team was shattered in the last handful of minutes and needed to be shaken back to steady?

GoCats!
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RE: Fact: We Were Out Coached

Posted: 12/4/2011 10:03:02 AM

Maybe the coaches were dedicating the 2nd half to Jim Tressel? As a Columbus Bobcat, I've been forced to sit through eerily similar play schemes from O$U.

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