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For those who missed it, LeBron James tweeted his support of the law: https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/09/05/lebron-j... The law -- which would only apply to schools in California -- would make it illegal for schools to take away scholarships or eligibility from any student athlete for making money from endorsements. In essence, it maintains amateurism while not limiting ability to earn outside income from endorsements, much like Olympic athletes. It would also enable players to work with agents on such deals. If this law passes, I'd have to think it'd be a boon for California schools when it comes to recruiting top athletes. And if those schools are perceived to have an advantage, I'd expect there to be a domino effect in other states. Back to Top rpbobcat General User Member Since: 4/28/2006 Location: Rochelle Park, NJ Post Count: 3,570 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/6/2019 11:46:59 AM  There were a couple of stories about this on the news out here. According the news stories,even even if Ca. does pass this law,the provisions in it still violate NCAA Rules. So it remains to be seen,how the NCAA will deal with it. Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,470 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/6/2019 12:13:22 PM  Each year I get more convinced that the days of college sports are fading. What began as little more than a club sport in the 1880s has grown into big business, only loosely connected to the core mission of the universities. The current system is based on the principles of socialism, where every athlete receives the same thing, regardless of their success. They get a free education, room and board, nutritional training, healthcare, academic support, etc, and the third string player with a scholarship gets exactly the same as the star. With virtually every university losing money at athletics, the day is coming when football, and perhaps other sports, will be spun off from universities and replaced by some sort of free enterprise variant. The players will be compensated, with the best athletes getting more than they do now, but with the majority getting less. In the end, each athlete will be compensated based on their ability to generate revenue. Sports that generate little revenue will return to their former status, club sports, where people do it for fun, and for the spirit of competition. In all of this prediction, I see great irony. The people who normally support socialism are the ones who most strongly favor abandoning the current socialist system, while those that normally favor free enterprise are the ones who strongly support the current system. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame General User Member Since: 7/30/2010 Post Count: 3,616 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/6/2019 3:22:46 PM  L.C. wrote: The current system is based on the principles of socialism, where every athlete receives the same thing, regardless of their success. They get a free education, room and board, nutritional training, healthcare, academic support, etc, and the third string player with a scholarship gets exactly the same as the star. I get what you're saying here, but some of this is incorrect. Other parts are an idealized view of how the NCAA/Universities actually operate. For instance, the star player and the third string guy aren't actually treated equally. The star never has his scholarship pulled, the third string guy does pretty frequently. Further, the third string guy may have only been offered a partial scholarship to begin with. It may cover only a portion of costs. Also, you might want to look into how healthcare actually works in college athletics. In many, many cases players' health insurance plans and costs aren't covered by the university. Universities require them to have insurance, but in practice many are on their parents' plans. Alabama, for instance, covers 100% of costs. If you play basketball at Maine on the other hand, you pay the first $10,000 of any healthcare cost. L.C. wrote: In all of this prediction, I see great irony. The people who normally support socialism are the ones who most strongly favor abandoning the current socialist system, while those that normally favor free enterprise are the ones who strongly support the current system. Again, get what you're saying and I do see the irony, but the "socialist" system in this case makes a whole bunch of people very, very rich, just not the 'workers.' Hard to think NCAA sports are socialist when the highest paid employee in half the states are coaches. Last Edited: 9/6/2019 5:25:03 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame Back to Top . General User Member Since: 2/3/2005 Post Count: 2,997 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/6/2019 4:06:21 PM  L.C. wrote: In all of this prediction, I see great irony. The people who normally support socialism are the ones who most strongly favor abandoning the current socialist system, while those that normally favor free enterprise are the ones who strongly support the current system. Funny enough, I was thinking about this exact thing while my mind was wandering while working the other night. It goes to show how much cognitive dissonance we all allow into our thinking no matter our core beliefs when it comes to things we love. I really don't blame either side. One side loves college football as it is and is willing to overlook a lot to maintain it. The other really doesn't like what has happened to the priorities of universities and is willing to argue for a system they'd otherwise hate. I understand both, but think we should always err towards the individual having the right to do what they feel best. It's likely blowing up the system will turn disastrous, but if we're going to really live up to what we preach, adults can't be treated like children in this situation and we can't keep subsidizing the sports that don't make money just because we like the idea of a fair and just college athletics system. Not when so many of our colleges and universities are struggling so much. Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,470 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/6/2019 8:10:26 PM  Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote: ... For instance, the star player and the third string guy aren't actually treated equally. The star never has his scholarship pulled, the third string guy does pretty frequently. Further, the third string guy may have only been offered a partial scholarship to begin with. It may cover only a portion of costs. ... Certainly some schools are more aggressive about pulling scholarships than others. The other part of your statement is incorrect. While some sports do have partial scholarships, football is not one of them. Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote: ... Again, get what you're saying and I do see the irony, but the "socialist" system in this case makes a whole bunch of people very, very rich, just not the 'workers.' Hard to think NCAA sports are socialist when the highest paid employee in half the states are coaches. Blame the coaches salaries on impatient fans, who always seem to believe that if they just get the right coach, they can win a National Championship. As for the "workers", consider that in a truly capitalistic system, there would be no scholarships at all in non-revenue sports. Thus, anyone who gets a scholarship in one is getting more than they have "earned". Brian Smith wrote: Funny enough, I was thinking about this exact thing while my mind was wandering while working the other night. It goes to show how much cognitive dissonance we all allow into our thinking no matter our core beliefs when it comes to things we love. I really don't blame either side. One side loves college football as it is and is willing to overlook a lot to maintain it. The other really doesn't like what has happened to the priorities of universities and is willing to argue for a system they'd otherwise hate. I understand both, but think we should always err towards the individual having the right to do what they feel best. It's likely blowing up the system will turn disastrous, but if we're going to really live up to what we preach, adults can't be treated like children in this situation and we can't keep subsidizing the sports that don't make money just because we like the idea of a fair and just college athletics system. Not when so many of our colleges and universities are struggling so much. Well said. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top BillyTheCat General User Member Since: 10/6/2012 Post Count: 10,003 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/7/2019 11:49:01 PM  Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote: L.C. wrote: The current system is based on the principles of socialism, where every athlete receives the same thing, regardless of their success. They get a free education, room and board, nutritional training, healthcare, academic support, etc, and the third string player with a scholarship gets exactly the same as the star. I get what you're saying here, but some of this is incorrect. Other parts are an idealized view of how the NCAA/Universities actually operate. For instance, the star player and the third string guy aren't actually treated equally. The star never has his scholarship pulled, the third string guy does pretty frequently. Further, the third string guy may have only been offered a partial scholarship to begin with. It may cover only a portion of costs. Also, you might want to look into how healthcare actually works in college athletics. In many, many cases players' health insurance plans and costs aren't covered by the university. Universities require them to have insurance, but in practice many are on their parents' plans. Alabama, for instance, covers 100% of costs. If you play basketball at Maine on the other hand, you pay the first $10,000 of any healthcare cost. L.C. wrote: In all of this prediction, I see great irony. The people who normally support socialism are the ones who most strongly favor abandoning the current socialist system, while those that normally favor free enterprise are the ones who strongly support the current system. Again, get what you're saying and I do see the irony, but the "socialist" system in this case makes a whole bunch of people very, very rich, just not the 'workers.' Hard to think NCAA sports are socialist when the highest paid employee in half the states are coaches. No SUCH THING AS A PARTIAL SCHOLARSHIP IN FOOTBALL OR BASKETBALL. Back to Top Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame General User Member Since: 7/30/2010 Post Count: 3,616 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/9/2019 10:35:50 AM  L.C. wrote: Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote: ... For instance, the star player and the third string guy aren't actually treated equally. The star never has his scholarship pulled, the third string guy does pretty frequently. Further, the third string guy may have only been offered a partial scholarship to begin with. It may cover only a portion of costs. ... Certainly some schools are more aggressive about pulling scholarships than others. The other part of your statement is incorrect. While some sports do have partial scholarships, football is not one of them. Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote: ... Again, get what you're saying and I do see the irony, but the "socialist" system in this case makes a whole bunch of people very, very rich, just not the 'workers.' Hard to think NCAA sports are socialist when the highest paid employee in half the states are coaches. Blame the coaches salaries on impatient fans, who always seem to believe that if they just get the right coach, they can win a National Championship. As for the "workers", consider that in a truly capitalistic system, there would be no scholarships at all in non-revenue sports. Thus, anyone who gets a scholarship in one is getting more than they have "earned". Brian Smith wrote: Funny enough, I was thinking about this exact thing while my mind was wandering while working the other night. It goes to show how much cognitive dissonance we all allow into our thinking no matter our core beliefs when it comes to things we love. I really don't blame either side. One side loves college football as it is and is willing to overlook a lot to maintain it. The other really doesn't like what has happened to the priorities of universities and is willing to argue for a system they'd otherwise hate. I understand both, but think we should always err towards the individual having the right to do what they feel best. It's likely blowing up the system will turn disastrous, but if we're going to really live up to what we preach, adults can't be treated like children in this situation and we can't keep subsidizing the sports that don't make money just because we like the idea of a fair and just college athletics system. Not when so many of our colleges and universities are struggling so much. Well said. I know I posted this in the football section of the board -- but the law applies across sports. Football and basketball may not have partial scholarships, but the point I was making is that the idea that everybody from the star on down are treated identically doesn't really hold to scrutiny. Also, I don't really think it's accurate to blame coaches salaries on inpatient fans. The salaries are directly connected to revenue. You know, like in capitalism. There's a reason Duke pays Coach K more than Ohio pays Boals, and fan expectations play only a small role in that. We could have the highest expectations around, and we still can't afford to pay Boals much more than we currently do. Back to Top TWT General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Alexandria, VA Post Count: 5,102 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/10/2019 6:28:27 AM  Salaries at the big boys are reflective of an addiction to TV money they have within their means. Salaries at Ohio are indexed relative to the MAC to stay above lower tier conferences and reflect a market rate for a MAC coach. Boals is not paid necessarily what the school has a capacity to pay but what its felt that Ohio needs to pay to attract a coach of his caliber. Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended 2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round 2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl 2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086 Back to Top TWT General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Alexandria, VA Post Count: 5,102 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/11/2019 9:16:54 AM  L.C. wrote: Each year I get more convinced that the days of college sports are fading. What began as little more than a club sport in the 1880s has grown into big business, only loosely connected to the core mission of the universities. The current system is based on the principles of socialism, where every athlete receives the same thing, regardless of their success. They get a free education, room and board, nutritional training, healthcare, academic support, etc, and the third string player with a scholarship gets exactly the same as the star. With virtually every university losing money at athletics, the day is coming when football, and perhaps other sports, will be spun off from universities and replaced by some sort of free enterprise variant. The players will be compensated, with the best athletes getting more than they do now, but with the majority getting less. In the end, each athlete will be compensated based on their ability to generate revenue. Sports that generate little revenue will return to their former status, club sports, where people do it for fun, and for the spirit of competition. In all of this prediction, I see great irony. The people who normally support socialism are the ones who most strongly favor abandoning the current socialist system, while those that normally favor free enterprise are the ones who strongly support the current system. Its more that we lack a consensus on what a cost model for college players getting endorsements would look like. Will it be something where a Learfield will be hired by a university to be a broker for corporate endorsements of the student athletes? They would get a cut, say 5% and another 5% is shared team wide. This way all parties are incentivized to win, not only start athlete. The more successful the team, the greater the number of endorsements from say a bottom level MAC team to a NYD bowl contender program. That would benefit Ohio as a good MAC team with likely the best media rights deal in the conference. Does it also benefit a UCLA or Rutgers with the larger media markets? I'd be for doing away with the athletic scholarship model but keeping the COLA stipend. The legitimacy of an athletic scholarship is questionable, particularly when they olympic sports are restricted in some cases to offering up only partial scholarships. With this system in the case of 4 star players their endorsement value might be highest as freshman and if they don't pan out (grades or performance) they may be forced to quit vs. showing up at JUCO to give that NFL dream one more time. Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended 2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round 2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl 2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086 Back to Top TWT General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Alexandria, VA Post Count: 5,102 Status: Offline     RE: Fair Pay to Play Act    Posted: 9/11/2019 9:43:27 AM  Also FBS schools now have merit aid programs. I'll give you an example of a 4 star defensive back from Michigan who is recruited to play at Michigan. At a place like Michigan the line for merit aid is for arguments sake a 30 and the DB has 28 so he's below the threshold. Yet he Michigan a try because with their B1G network the potential exists for a six figure endorsement if he's all Big Ten. He goes to Michigan and can't make the two deep so the DB transfers to a place like Ohio where that 28 ACT will give him a full tuition ride as an out-of-state student and with the sorrid state of Ohio's secondary he's instantly part of the 2 deep with a better chance at earning endorsements with playing time in the MAC. Miami would be up a creek in MAC football with how expensive they are to attend without a full ride. Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended 2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round 2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl 2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086 Back to Top Showing Replies:   1 - 11  of 11 Posts Jump to Page:   1 View Other 'Ohio Football' Topics                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               WHO'S ONLINE There are 341 Active Visitors on BobcatAttack.com 340 Guests 1 Registered User:   OUs LONG Driver There are no other users looking at this page.

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