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Topic:  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it

Topic:  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
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Club Hyatt
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/6/2022 9:58:38 PM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
colobobcat66 wrote:
Itís not going to be a lot of fun for the fan bases of the teams that canít keep up. Between the transfer portal and pay for play, itís starting to look a lot like a pro sport.


4. If things continue in this direction the MAC teams in bigger cities -- UA, WMU, UT, UB and maybe to a lesser extent BSU will be at a distinct advantage, without major infusion of cash from the alumni bases of the other schools.


Individual market advantages are going to be a problem in every conference. There is going to be interest in creating conference wide NIL deals just like the way TV money is distributed. MAC has a good corporate base across its states.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Club Hyatt
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/6/2022 10:13:12 PM 
The Optimist wrote:
Buckeye to Bobcat wrote:
I hate to say this, but every athletic department should be evaluating where they want their boosters throwing the poker chips. Going all in on football seems to be a crazy prospect. Going all in on basketball however......not as much. Especially considering for $1 million, you could buy a starting 5 in the transfer portal or recruiting. Whereas if this is the market value for a QB1, the other 21 spots better do their job or that's a waste. ROI is going to matter at some point, wish we had a way to organize a way to invest wisely


Agreed. It's a simple business matter of ROI. Better returns in basketball than football for OHIO.


Football ROI is tied more to scheduling. Name schools in Peden and dates to maximize crowd interest. Its less about the on field performance than the perceived level. Unless the team is undefeated that particular year which would drive revenue.

Basketball ROI is tied more directly to earning NCAA credits and winning. There is no such thing as a NCAA credit in football and bowl payouts are a small source of income.

Last Edited: 1/6/2022 10:13:51 PM by Club Hyatt


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 10:18:09 AM 
Pataskala wrote:
Batch's offer will likely wind up to be nothing more than a publicity stunt. Caleb Williams will want to go to a place where (A) he can play for a national championship and (B) he'll be a high first-round pick in the NFL draft. EMU offers neither of those. As they say, a flower smells only as good as the manure around it and the manure at EMU is pretty raunchy for someone with Williams's aspirations. Neither Batch nor EMU has the cash to lure other good players there if they blow their wad on one elite player whose future depends on an offensive line and decent receivers. At EMU he would wind up being a ticket seller and little more. If Batch were really interested in improving EMU's lot in life, he'd offer $100,000 to ten three- or four-star players to transfer. While NIL might be sweeten the pot, what still sells elite players on a program are coaches, facilities and national championship potential.

But of course, what Batch is doing might be outside the realm of NIL, since he apparently hasn't made the million-dollar offer contingent on use of Williams's NIL. Sounds like strictly a pay-for-play scheme which is supposed to still be taboo.


No pay to play is defined as performance based. This is no different than the University of Texas donor who is NILíing every O-Lineman $50k.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 11:21:38 AM 
L.C. wrote:

So, to make it fair, would you advocate an open negotiation for every player? I agree that some are worth far more than a full ride scholarship, but perhaps some are worth less? Given that the team as a whole operates at a loss, the overall "pay" of full ride scholars for everyone may be too much, and thus, the "fair" thing might be to increase the "pay" for the stars, and decrease it for everyone else?

Alternatively, if it is going to be treated like a business, the best choice may be to shut it down (unless those missing millions of revenue can be found).


I mean, yeah. I am, broadly speaking, in favor of free markets and that certainly applies to labor markets. I think that people should be free to earn what they can earn based on the hard work they do, and can't really think of many highly regulated industries/countries/markets that suggest otherwise. The idea that player movement, scholarship offerings, and NIL money should be regulated and limited in order to maintain a very thin veneer of competitive balance amongst 130 FBS schools kind of seems nuts to me.

Given the structural differences and huge variability in resources that exists between an Ohio State and an Ohio University, creating one size fits all regulation seems grossly unfair to the individuals who generate the lion's share of the NCAA's revenue. That OU can't compete isn't new, nor is it something we're entitled to. I find the idea of taking money that somebody worked hard to earn out of their pocket because OU football fans want to continue living under the delusion that we're able to compete at the top level of college football to be pretty morally repugnant.

As for shutting football down, that may be a rational choice. But I'd suggest that there are many businesses that run loss leading divisions because they see value that's not reflected in revenue, and I think there's a compelling case to be made that that applies to college athletics. I'd lean towards believing it. What I don't think makes sense is dumping resources into competing at a level we can't. There are far more economically viable ways of running a football program than paying a bad coach 2x what you pay the President of the University.





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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 11:23:45 AM 
There's an article in today's The Record (Darren Cooper,USA Today Network) about players sitting out games/seasons is starting to filter down to high schools.
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spongeBOB CATpants
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 12:22:53 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:
There's an article in today's The Record (Darren Cooper,USA Today Network) about players sitting out games/seasons is starting to filter down to high schools.


Well you don't have to look very far for a prime, prime example. Quinn Ewers, the former OSU QB and 5 star recruit (and next Peyton Manning), sat out his entire senior year of high school to re-classify to take advantage of pre-negotiated NIL deals that were negotiated while still in high school (rumors were that it was close to a mil).

How'd that work out you might ask?

Played 2 snaps (both handoffs), was enrolled for 1 semester, and is now in the transfer portal to head back home to Texas.

Thanks Coach Day, smell ya later!
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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 2:00:34 PM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Well you don't have to look very far for a prime, prime example. Quinn Ewers, the former OSU QB and 5 star recruit (and next Peyton Manning), sat out his entire senior year of high school to re-classify to take advantage of pre-negotiated NIL deals that were negotiated while still in high school (rumors were that it was close to a mil).

How'd that work out you might ask?

Played 2 snaps (both handoffs), was enrolled for 1 semester, and is now in the transfer portal to head back home to Texas.

Thanks Coach Day, smell ya later!


From what I was reading, Ewers expected to be OSU's starting Q.B. next
season or sooner.

When it became apparent that CJ Stroud was going be the starter for 1-2 more seasons, he started looking at his other options.

Since he's from Texas, the Longhorns were more then happy to take him.

Last Edited: 1/7/2022 2:01:12 PM by rpbobcat

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colobobcat66
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 3:55:15 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
L.C. wrote:

So, to make it fair, would you advocate an open negotiation for every player? I agree that some are worth far more than a full ride scholarship, but perhaps some are worth less? Given that the team as a whole operates at a loss, the overall "pay" of full ride scholars for everyone may be too much, and thus, the "fair" thing might be to increase the "pay" for the stars, and decrease it for everyone else?

Alternatively, if it is going to be treated like a business, the best choice may be to shut it down (unless those missing millions of revenue can be found).


I mean, yeah. I am, broadly speaking, in favor of free markets and that certainly applies to labor markets. I think that people should be free to earn what they can earn based on the hard work they do, and can't really think of many highly regulated industries/countries/markets that suggest otherwise. The idea that player movement, scholarship offerings, and NIL money should be regulated and limited in order to maintain a very thin veneer of competitive balance amongst 130 FBS schools kind of seems nuts to me.

Given the structural differences and huge variability in resources that exists between an Ohio State and an Ohio University, creating one size fits all regulation seems grossly unfair to the individuals who generate the lion's share of the NCAA's revenue. That OU can't compete isn't new, nor is it something we're entitled to. I find the idea of taking money that somebody worked hard to earn out of their pocket because OU football fans want to continue living under the delusion that we're able to compete at the top level of college football to be pretty morally repugnant.

As for shutting football down, that may be a rational choice. But I'd suggest that there are many businesses that run loss leading divisions because they see value that's not reflected in revenue, and I think there's a compelling case to be made that that applies to college athletics. I'd lean towards believing it. What I don't think makes sense is dumping resources into competing at a level we can't. There are far more economically viable ways of running a football program than paying a bad coach 2x what you pay the President of the University.







Iím not sure who youíre talking about who thinks weíre trying to compete at the level of the Ohio States of this world, particularly in the major sports. We have an athletic budget that is less than 1/5 of many major schools, have a dilapidated stadium build almost 100 years ago, pay our coaches in the lowest 10% of D-1 coaches, have made improvements to facilities of less than - what 10-12 mil in the last decade. Just how exactly are we dumping resources to compete at the highest level? We are making minimum investments to keep up mostly with our MAC brethren, not the Ohio States of this world. As to running a football program thatís pays its coach less than twice what the college pres is making, weíre doing that- heís making 9% more, not double.

Last Edited: 1/7/2022 3:57:47 PM by colobobcat66

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spongeBOB CATpants
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 4:07:54 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Well you don't have to look very far for a prime, prime example. Quinn Ewers, the former OSU QB and 5 star recruit (and next Peyton Manning), sat out his entire senior year of high school to re-classify to take advantage of pre-negotiated NIL deals that were negotiated while still in high school (rumors were that it was close to a mil).

How'd that work out you might ask?

Played 2 snaps (both handoffs), was enrolled for 1 semester, and is now in the transfer portal to head back home to Texas.

Thanks Coach Day, smell ya later!


From what I was reading, Ewers expected to be OSU's starting Q.B. next
season or sooner.

When it became apparent that CJ Stroud was going be the starter for 1-2 more seasons, he started looking at his other options.

Since he's from Texas, the Longhorns were more then happy to take him.


Not sure why he expected to beat out another 5 star and two 4 star QBs that were already in the program at the time of his reclassification.

Unless Ryan Day promised the starting job, I see no other reason other than NIL money for signing.
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 5:27:25 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
L.C. wrote:

So, to make it fair, would you advocate an open negotiation for every player? I agree that some are worth far more than a full ride scholarship, but perhaps some are worth less? Given that the team as a whole operates at a loss, the overall "pay" of full ride scholars for everyone may be too much, and thus, the "fair" thing might be to increase the "pay" for the stars, and decrease it for everyone else?

Alternatively, if it is going to be treated like a business, the best choice may be to shut it down (unless those missing millions of revenue can be found).


I mean, yeah. I am, broadly speaking, in favor of free markets and that certainly applies to labor markets. I think that people should be free to earn what they can earn based on the hard work they do, and can't really think of many highly regulated industries/countries/markets that suggest otherwise. The idea that player movement, scholarship offerings, and NIL money should be regulated and limited in order to maintain a very thin veneer of competitive balance amongst 130 FBS schools kind of seems nuts to me.

Given the structural differences and huge variability in resources that exists between an Ohio State and an Ohio University, creating one size fits all regulation seems grossly unfair to the individuals who generate the lion's share of the NCAA's revenue. That OU can't compete isn't new, nor is it something we're entitled to. I find the idea of taking money that somebody worked hard to earn out of their pocket because OU football fans want to continue living under the delusion that we're able to compete at the top level of college football to be pretty morally repugnant.

As for shutting football down, that may be a rational choice. But I'd suggest that there are many businesses that run loss leading divisions because they see value that's not reflected in revenue, and I think there's a compelling case to be made that that applies to college athletics. I'd lean towards believing it. What I don't think makes sense is dumping resources into competing at a level we can't. There are far more economically viable ways of running a football program than paying a bad coach 2x what you pay the President of the University.

In today's economy, the value of a five year full ride is very high. The current system mandates that one-size-fit-all solution, where everyone gets exactly the same "pay", a full scholarship. Absolutely, there are players who are worth more than that, and there are also players worth less than that. Realistically, most, or all of those players who are "worth" more than the value of a scholarship are probably playing for a top team. Maybe the solution is to let Ohio State pay millions for their players, and at the same time, let schools like Ohio award partial scholarships to some players, to reduce their expenses to match their revenue. That would be the free market at work.

BTW, I agree that coaching salaries have gotten ridiculous. I think that's a function of, you can't pay the players, and you have money, so the one place you can use your money to improve results is on the coach. I think that pay for players will solve the over-paid coach issue, to some extent.


ďWe have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.Ē ― Epictetus

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 6:58:41 PM 
colobobcat66 wrote:

Iím not sure who youíre talking about who thinks weíre trying to compete at the level of the Ohio States of this world, particularly in the major sports.


The first post in this thread ends with "How are we supposed to compete with that?" in reference to a million dollar NIL offer, which to-date's only been matched by schools like Ohio State.

There have been like a dozen conversations here about how the NIL will make it impossible to compete for schools like Ohio University.

colobobcat66 wrote:

We have an athletic budget that is less than 1/5 of many major schools, have a dilapidated stadium build almost 100 years ago, pay our coaches in the lowest 10% of D-1 coaches, have made improvements to facilities of less than - what 10-12 mil in the last decade. Just how exactly are we dumping resources to compete at the highest level?


The highest level is FBS, which sets requirements for schools around scholarships, stadium capacity and a whole range of other things. When I say "competing at the highest level" that's what I mean. I've read the standings and noticed over the last 40 years that we've never actually competed at the highest level.

colobobcat66 wrote:

We are making minimum investments to keep up mostly with our MAC brethren, not the Ohio States of this world.


You and I define the word investment differently. I think of it as something that might yield returns. What's our investment yield if it's done to "keep up with our MAC brethren"? Why is that good and how do we justify it?

colobobcat66 wrote:

As to running a football program thatís pays its coach less than twice what the college pres is making, weíre doing that- heís making 9% more, not double.


For some reason I had the sense our Presidents were paid less. Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss? This is, to be clear, another area where we're dumping money.
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Club Hyatt
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/7/2022 8:07:23 PM 
L.C. wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
L.C. wrote:

So, to make it fair, would you advocate an open negotiation for every player? I agree that some are worth far more than a full ride scholarship, but perhaps some are worth less? Given that the team as a whole operates at a loss, the overall "pay" of full ride scholars for everyone may be too much, and thus, the "fair" thing might be to increase the "pay" for the stars, and decrease it for everyone else?

Alternatively, if it is going to be treated like a business, the best choice may be to shut it down (unless those missing millions of revenue can be found).


I mean, yeah. I am, broadly speaking, in favor of free markets and that certainly applies to labor markets. I think that people should be free to earn what they can earn based on the hard work they do, and can't really think of many highly regulated industries/countries/markets that suggest otherwise. The idea that player movement, scholarship offerings, and NIL money should be regulated and limited in order to maintain a very thin veneer of competitive balance amongst 130 FBS schools kind of seems nuts to me.

Given the structural differences and huge variability in resources that exists between an Ohio State and an Ohio University, creating one size fits all regulation seems grossly unfair to the individuals who generate the lion's share of the NCAA's revenue. That OU can't compete isn't new, nor is it something we're entitled to. I find the idea of taking money that somebody worked hard to earn out of their pocket because OU football fans want to continue living under the delusion that we're able to compete at the top level of college football to be pretty morally repugnant.

As for shutting football down, that may be a rational choice. But I'd suggest that there are many businesses that run loss leading divisions because they see value that's not reflected in revenue, and I think there's a compelling case to be made that that applies to college athletics. I'd lean towards believing it. What I don't think makes sense is dumping resources into competing at a level we can't. There are far more economically viable ways of running a football program than paying a bad coach 2x what you pay the President of the University.

In today's economy, the value of a five year full ride is very high. The current system mandates that one-size-fit-all solution, where everyone gets exactly the same "pay", a full scholarship. Absolutely, there are players who are worth more than that, and there are also players worth less than that. Realistically, most, or all of those players who are "worth" more than the value of a scholarship are probably playing for a top team. Maybe the solution is to let Ohio State pay millions for their players, and at the same time, let schools like Ohio award partial scholarships to some players, to reduce their expenses to match their revenue. That would be the free market at work.

BTW, I agree that coaching salaries have gotten ridiculous. I think that's a function of, you can't pay the players, and you have money, so the one place you can use your money to improve results is on the coach. I think that pay for players will solve the over-paid coach issue, to some extent.


NIL is a nightmare for everyone particularly the biggest programs because they are so dependent on money flowing in and COVID turned off the spigot. NYC gets behind Rutgers and Chicago gets behind Northwestern. Both are beating Ohio State which they can't afford. One loss to Oregon and 30,000 empty seats at the horseshoe. How do they survive 8-4 seasons?

The shoestring programs have less to worry about. They'll compete up to their resource limits as they have always done. You won't see a big redirection of alumni giving at Ohio to athletics like you might at Alabama. What does it do the university mission? I would rather be outspent in athletics than to lower the academic mission.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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colobobcat66
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 9:28:22 AM 


Last Edited: 1/8/2022 9:32:37 AM by colobobcat66

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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 10:06:50 AM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
rpbobcat wrote:
There's an article in today's The Record (Darren Cooper,USA Today Network) about players sitting out games/seasons is starting to filter down to high schools.


Well you don't have to look very far for a prime, prime example. Quinn Ewers, the former OSU QB and 5 star recruit (and next Peyton Manning), sat out his entire senior year of high school to re-classify to take advantage of pre-negotiated NIL deals that were negotiated while still in high school (rumors were that it was close to a mil).

How'd that work out you might ask?

Played 2 snaps (both handoffs), was enrolled for 1 semester, and is now in the transfer portal to head back home to Texas.

Thanks Coach Day, smell ya later!


He left because he signed those deals, and then the Texas legislature killed their own NIL bill for high school kids. He got huge publicity out of it, got paid and did what thousands of others have done. Left.

Will not be long until you see NIL in the high school level, discussions in the OHIO House last year on this.
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 10:08:37 AM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
rpbobcat wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Well you don't have to look very far for a prime, prime example. Quinn Ewers, the former OSU QB and 5 star recruit (and next Peyton Manning), sat out his entire senior year of high school to re-classify to take advantage of pre-negotiated NIL deals that were negotiated while still in high school (rumors were that it was close to a mil).

How'd that work out you might ask?

Played 2 snaps (both handoffs), was enrolled for 1 semester, and is now in the transfer portal to head back home to Texas.

Thanks Coach Day, smell ya later!


From what I was reading, Ewers expected to be OSU's starting Q.B. next
season or sooner.

When it became apparent that CJ Stroud was going be the starter for 1-2 more seasons, he started looking at his other options.

Since he's from Texas, the Longhorns were more then happy to take him.


Not sure why he expected to beat out another 5 star and two 4 star QBs that were already in the program at the time of his reclassification.

Unless Ryan Day promised the starting job, I see no other reason other than NIL money for signing.


Every player thinks they are the best and will be the starter. And yeah, he wanted the NIL money, he never made that a secret. Transferring after the year that Stroud put up, is not a bad idea for a very talented young QB
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 11:30:51 AM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Unless Ryan Day promised the starting job, I see no other reason other than NIL money for signing.


Does he need another reason?

In general, any 18 year old who has already identified the career they hope to pursue and is offered 1 million dollars to leave high school early and practice said career at a much higher level, should do so.

There's this insinuation that taking money is bad, but it only seems to apply to college athletes. In what other scenario would we hold it against a person who accepts money in exchange for something they're very good at?

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Ohio69
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 1:25:19 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss?


Because itís not a loss. Itís for student, alum, community, customer etc. engagement and PR. At many schools itís like 2% -3% of overall budget and school leaders and alums/donors/students/ communities donít mind dedicating funding to it. Folks have been predicting the end of the NCAA and college sports for years and years now. Itís gonna keep surviving because the universities (leaders, students, alums, donors, community) want it to.


Can somebody hit a pull up jumper for me?.....

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 2:59:47 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Unless Ryan Day promised the starting job, I see no other reason other than NIL money for signing.


Does he need another reason?

In general, any 18 year old who has already identified the career they hope to pursue and is offered 1 million dollars to leave high school early and practice said career at a much higher level, should do so.

There's this insinuation that taking money is bad, but it only seems to apply to college athletes. In what other scenario would we hold it against a person who accepts money in exchange for something they're very good at?



Suppose the kid were a computer whiz or a business genius. Would anyone complain if he were offered a million to leave high school early and go to college somewhere on a full ride (or even go to work)? People would say he's an "inspiration." And who would bring more attention -- and maybe money in the form of ticket sales and donations -- to the university: the computer whiz/business genius or the athlete?


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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RSBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/8/2022 9:15:39 PM 
And we should ASAP w/Sears......


RS Bobcat

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/9/2022 11:56:13 AM 
Ohio69 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss?


Because itís not a loss. Itís for student, alum, community, customer etc. engagement and PR. At many schools itís like 2% -3% of overall budget and school leaders and alums/donors/students/ communities donít mind dedicating funding to it. Folks have been predicting the end of the NCAA and college sports for years and years now. Itís gonna keep surviving because the universities (leaders, students, alums, donors, community) want it to.



This isn't quite an answer. It's a sentiment, and one I understand and agree with for the most part. But to be more specific about what I'm asking: why is it necessary to spend $600k on a football coach to accomplish all of the above instead of, say, $350k?

Given the level we compete at in the MAC, I'm not sure I see the justification of increasing salaries over the last 10 years.
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spongeBOB CATpants
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/9/2022 5:01:25 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:


Unless Ryan Day promised the starting job, I see no other reason other than NIL money for signing.


Does he need another reason?

In general, any 18 year old who has already identified the career they hope to pursue and is offered 1 million dollars to leave high school early and practice said career at a much higher level, should do so.

There's this insinuation that taking money is bad, but it only seems to apply to college athletes. In what other scenario would we hold it against a person who accepts money in exchange for something they're very good at?



No, no he does not. Definitely the smartest decision for him personally and I'm not trying to argue otherwise.

Student-athletes deserve the money but I will say that it makes NCAA football less enjoyable for me.

This is the new norm, just going to take some getting used to. I used to not think much of the whole "amateurism" allure that college sports brought to the table but now I think we're all going to miss it.
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giacomo
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/11/2022 11:00:21 PM 
Itís really pretty simple. When coaches get paid mega millions it draws into question the whole system and why we are where we are. We either have an amateur system where coaches are paid on the scale of a dean, or itís something else and everyone has their hand out. Itís something else.
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/11/2022 11:20:47 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Ohio69 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss?


Because itís not a loss. Itís for student, alum, community, customer etc. engagement and PR. At many schools itís like 2% -3% of overall budget and school leaders and alums/donors/students/ communities donít mind dedicating funding to it. Folks have been predicting the end of the NCAA and college sports for years and years now. Itís gonna keep surviving because the universities (leaders, students, alums, donors, community) want it to.



This isn't quite an answer. It's a sentiment, and one I understand and agree with for the most part. But to be more specific about what I'm asking: why is it necessary to spend $600k on a football coach to accomplish all of the above instead of, say, $350k?

Given the level we compete at in the MAC, I'm not sure I see the justification of increasing salaries over the last 10 years.

I'm just curious, but why do you favor the kids being paid what they are "worth", i.e., what the market will pay, but oppose paying coaches what they are "worth"?


ďWe have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.Ē ― Epictetus

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Club Hyatt
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/12/2022 1:27:16 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Ohio69 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss?


Because itís not a loss. Itís for student, alum, community, customer etc. engagement and PR. At many schools itís like 2% -3% of overall budget and school leaders and alums/donors/students/ communities donít mind dedicating funding to it. Folks have been predicting the end of the NCAA and college sports for years and years now. Itís gonna keep surviving because the universities (leaders, students, alums, donors, community) want it to.



This isn't quite an answer. It's a sentiment, and one I understand and agree with for the most part. But to be more specific about what I'm asking: why is it necessary to spend $600k on a football coach to accomplish all of the above instead of, say, $350k?

Given the level we compete at in the MAC, I'm not sure I see the justification of increasing salaries over the last 10 years.


Its about staying ahead of the FCS in pay. The coach of NDSU is making $380k and the coach at JMU is making $425k. Albin at $510k is not exactly backing up the brinks truck when you think about what the bigger jobs in FCS pay. Ohio has a bigger stadium than both those programs.

https://jamesmadison.rivals.com/news/jmu-s-assistant-coac...

Boals is paid as if he coaches in the Atlantic 10 but that is more Ohio's level than an average MAC basketball program if you go by budget and success in the tournament.

Ohio athletic department is not way out of line on salaries considering the marketplace. UT San Antonio in contrast spend $28 million on their coach length of contract which is almost the total what Lane Kiffin is getting at Ole Miss. That is what you do I guess when a program moves up to the AAC? Ohio is paying Albin an entry level FBS salary already.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Club Hyatt
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Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: You wanted players paid....Well you've got it
   Posted: 1/12/2022 1:37:46 AM 
L.C. wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Ohio69 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Can you explain why it's justified to pay football coaches more at a school that operates its football program at a loss?


Because itís not a loss. Itís for student, alum, community, customer etc. engagement and PR. At many schools itís like 2% -3% of overall budget and school leaders and alums/donors/students/ communities donít mind dedicating funding to it. Folks have been predicting the end of the NCAA and college sports for years and years now. Itís gonna keep surviving because the universities (leaders, students, alums, donors, community) want it to.



This isn't quite an answer. It's a sentiment, and one I understand and agree with for the most part. But to be more specific about what I'm asking: why is it necessary to spend $600k on a football coach to accomplish all of the above instead of, say, $350k?

Given the level we compete at in the MAC, I'm not sure I see the justification of increasing salaries over the last 10 years.

I'm just curious, but why do you favor the kids being paid what they are "worth", i.e., what the market will pay, but oppose paying coaches what they are "worth"?


He wants FCS but what he doesn't understand is that Ohio would be one of the biggest programs for that subdivision and still be paying a half a million for a football coach. The only difference is it would be millions less revenue than competing in an FBS conference. The current situation for Ohio is as good as it gets for a mid major program.

The question I think is what to do about keeping Jeff Boals. Groce was offered $750k to stay in Athens back in 2012 so I could see a bigger salary coming for Boals eventually. He's worth the coin when you see where he's taking the program.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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