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Topic:  Has the new field been installed?

Topic:  Has the new field been installed?
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 6/29/2022 3:08:27 PM 
Anyone have photos?
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Bobcatzblitz
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 6/30/2022 11:51:55 AM 
SBH wrote:
Anyone have photos?


I'll make the drive from Columbus to Athens if someone has my gas and take pics.

Cash App
$suxysuxy
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/1/2022 9:01:06 AM 
Yes, has been installed
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Valley Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/1/2022 9:40:02 AM 
I snuck in a few weeks ago when there was just the base layer down and no turf. So weird.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/2/2022 1:17:12 PM 
Any idea why they didn't put a pad under the turf?
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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/2/2022 4:43:37 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Any idea why they didn't put a pad under the turf?


None of the synthetic turf fields I design use a "shock pad" anymore.

The turf (carpet) is laid on a compacted stone base.

The cushioning comes from the "infill" which is,a mixture of sand and crumb
rubber.

The exact proportions of the depend on the manufacturer.

Then there's usually a thin "top" layer of rubber only.


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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/4/2022 4:16:57 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Any idea why they didn't put a pad under the turf?


None of the synthetic turf fields I design use a "shock pad" anymore.

The turf (carpet) is laid on a compacted stone base.

The cushioning comes from the "infill" which is,a mixture of sand and crumb
rubber.

The exact proportions of the depend on the manufacturer.

Then there's usually a thin "top" layer of rubber only.




Thatís kind of surprising because they make the surface safer and can extend the life of the turf.

https://themotzgroup.com/resources/blogs/how-can-a-shock-... /

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/4/2022 6:58:01 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:


Thatís kind of surprising because they make the surface safer and can extend the life of the turf.

https://themotzgroup.com/resources/blogs/how-can-a-shock-... /



The article you posted is from a company that makes/ uses "shock pads" so they might be a bit biased.

The material you posted talks about "G-Max" .
That's the standard we use for synthetic turf.

The G-Max is based on the infill material and compaction.
The turf is supposed to be "groomed" to maintain the required G-Max.
G Max is also supposed to tested regularly.
In fact a field's G Max can even be adjusted.

Same thing,regular (weekly) grooming extends turf life.

I've done several forensic investigations on fields where the turf wore prematurely.
In most cases I found it wasn't groomed properly.

The other thing that can reduce turf life is weather.







Last Edited: 7/4/2022 6:58:30 PM by rpbobcat

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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/5/2022 12:13:25 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:


Thatís kind of surprising because they make the surface safer and can extend the life of the turf.

https://themotzgroup.com/resources/blogs/how-can-a-shock-... /



The article you posted is from a company that makes/ uses "shock pads" so they might be a bit biased.

The material you posted talks about "G-Max" .
That's the standard we use for synthetic turf.

The G-Max is based on the infill material and compaction.
The turf is supposed to be "groomed" to maintain the required G-Max.
G Max is also supposed to tested regularly.
In fact a field's G Max can even be adjusted.

Same thing,regular (weekly) grooming extends turf life.

I've done several forensic investigations on fields where the turf wore prematurely.
In most cases I found it wasn't groomed properly.

The other thing that can reduce turf life is weather.











The link that I posted is the company that is installing the field.

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/5/2022 12:44:07 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:

The link that I posted is the company that is installing the field.



I looked at their website.

If I'm reading it correctly, a "shock pad" is just one of the options
they offer.

Their website says they've done 500+ fields.

But, unless I missed it, there's no indication as to how many used a
"Shock Pad".

As I posted, I've never used one on any of the synthetic turf fields
I've designed.

We spec the required G Max for the field, based on its use (sports, level of play, calendar).

Its always been accomplished just with infill.

Never even had a bidder suggest/recommend a "shock pad".

As I posted, the key to synthetic turf's safety (G Max) and "useful life" is
proper maintenance.

Something that is, unfortunately lacking in a number of fields I've inspected.

Usually, if a field is maintained, follow up G Max testing comes back fine.











Last Edited: 7/5/2022 1:19:13 PM by rpbobcat

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/5/2022 2:02:26 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:

The link that I posted is the company that is installing the field.



I looked at their website.

If I'm reading it correctly, a "shock pad" is just one of the options
they offer.

Their website says they've done 500+ fields.

But, unless I missed it, there's no indication as to how many used a
"Shock Pad".

As I posted, I've never used one on any of the synthetic turf fields
I've designed.

We spec the required G Max for the field, based on its use (sports, level of play, calendar).

Its always been accomplished just with infill.

Never even had a bidder suggest/recommend a "shock pad".

As I posted, the key to synthetic turf's safety (G Max) and "useful life" is
proper maintenance.

Something that is, unfortunately lacking in a number of fields I've inspected.

Usually, if a field is maintained, follow up G Max testing comes back fine.



Your post got me wondering about the "shock pad" issue, so I did some digging (figuratively ;-) )

Most of the fields I design are Field Turf.

Infill is installed at "x" lbs per square foot.
Based on the amount of infill they use, a "shock pad" is not needed.

If you use less infill, which some companies do, then you need a "shock pad".

Its also an issue with "natural" infills like cork, peat, coconut and/or olive cores.
These materials just don't have the same weight/cushioning as sand/cryogenic rubber.
So, as far as I know, fields with "natural" infill need a " shock pad".

All of my projects are "public" (schools, municipalities, parks , etc.)
Natural infill is a lot more expensive then sand/crumb rubber.
So I've never got to do one yet.





Last Edited: 7/5/2022 2:24:41 PM by rpbobcat

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Urban Bobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed? (NT)
   Posted: 7/8/2022 12:40:57 PM 

Last Edited: 7/8/2022 12:43:27 PM by Urban Bobcat


URBAN BOBCAT

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Ohio4Lyfe
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/9/2022 6:30:37 PM 
I will take some this week. It sounds like the field will be ready for prospects to camp later this month.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/11/2022 6:26:12 PM 
Apologies for misreporting. Stopped by the field today and there will be a very good pad placed under the turf. It's already delivered and waiting for the turf to be delivered.
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ytownbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 9:12:08 AM 
Read your posts. Couldn't understand why you would question a long time poster that is in the business of turf repair and replacement.
Especially since the sum of your knowledge and subsequent statements were off of a company's website.

If you are going to be a "watchdog" over athletics you should stay in your own lane. Specifically, OBC versus G&W.
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 9:16:18 AM 
What I don't understand is why Billy the Cat told us weeks ago that the field installation was complete.
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 1:59:20 PM 
SBH wrote:
What I don't understand is why Billy the Cat told us weeks ago that the field installation was complete.


Because I wanted to jerk your chain. You knew when you posted that the turf was not down yet. If you did you would not have asked the question ;-)
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 2:24:16 PM 
ytownbobcat wrote:
Read your posts. Couldn't understand why you would question a long time poster that is in the business of turf repair and replacement.
Especially since the sum of your knowledge and subsequent statements were off of a company's website.

If you are going to be a "watchdog" over athletics you should stay in your own lane. Specifically, OBC versus G&W.


Iíve been doing some work with a new and emerging company in the turf industry for the last 18 months that produces a product thatís cooler than traditional turf companies, has a GMax factor with a unique pad system and using an organic infill material instead of crumb rubber which has been linked to possible cancers. The website posting was to simply show that the company that is doing the work will be using a pad which was cited as not needed by our east coast expert.

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 4:09:48 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:


Iíve been doing some work with a new and emerging company in the turf industry for the last 18 months that produces a product thatís cooler than traditional turf companies, has a GMax factor with a unique pad system and using an organic infill material instead of crumb rubber which has been linked to possible cancers. The website posting was to simply show that the company that is doing the work will be using a pad which was cited as not needed by our east coast expert.



Not to get all technical, but I will. :-)

1.As I've posted, most fields I design are Field Turf.

Field Turf has been making a product called "Cool Play" that reduces surface heat by, according to the test results I've reviewed, up to 35 deg. ,compared to conventional infill systems.

But, it is more expensive and requires a "Shock Pad".

2.Natural infills have also been around for a while.
Originally the were primarily ground coconut husks.
Now they also include cork, peat, and ground olive cores.

But, as I also posted, they are much more expensive then conventional infill and
don't have the same "cushioning" as conventional infill.
Again, requiring a "Shock Pad".

3.Crumb rubber being linked to possible cancers is a "straw man".
As I said, all of the fields I've done use a crumb rubber /sand infill.

A lot of research has been done concerning a link between crumb rubber,
which is also used a "Fall Protection Material" for playgrounds and cancers.

Crumb rubber has been used as infill for synthetic turf, going back to the early
1990's.
As far as I know, in every instance where someone who played on a synthetic turf or used a playground with "Rubber Mulch" developed a cancer, it was found to be unrelated to crumb rubber.

That's why the sand/crumb rubber infill for synthetic turf fields and crumb rubber "mulch" Fall Protection Materials remain so popular.

Although, in the interest of full disclosure, crumb rubber mulch will get
get kids dirtier then "Wood Carpet".







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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 4:34:38 PM 
"Straw man" in your opinion. Here is one recent action that would dispute that.

https://www.chemistryworld.com/news/europe-raises-the-bar...

There are many others.

As for cost, cooler is better and lower G Max is better. The question is whether you want to improve athlete safety or not. Obviously OU does with the inclusion of a high quality pad which is a good thing.

I will give you this though, grooming is important and is neglected in most cases sometimes totally neglected.
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Urban Bobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 4:42:07 PM 
Have photos of the field, but absolutely impossible to download them without downloading my entire album. Who needs photos on a site?

Yesterday the field was a sea of filler/not grass.

Last Edited: 7/12/2022 4:56:14 PM by Urban Bobcat


URBAN BOBCAT

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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 6:38:32 PM 
Maybe Crumb rubber in synthetic fields causes cancer in Europe but not in the State of Washington: https://tinyurl.com/4rn2aehn

This discussion kind of reminds me of an advertisement years ago for a certain Ham radio screwdriver antenna by a competitor of the leader in the field. The ad claimed that the new company's antennas did not contain beryllium, a known cancer-causing substance, like the other company's did. Well, the competitor's antennas actually contained a copper-beryllium alloy with less than 2.5% beryllium. This was simply a scare tactic to drive customers from the other company to his company by the owner of the new company in the field. As it turns out, cooper-beryllium alloy with less than 2.5 percent beryllium is not designated as a carcinogen, even though beryllium itself is so designated.

Edit: I should point out that the original leader in the field is still in business, the competitor is not.

Last Edited: 7/12/2022 6:40:44 PM by OhioCatFan


"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/12/2022 7:07:18 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:
"Straw man" in your opinion. Here is one recent action that would dispute that.

https://www.chemistryworld.com/news/europe-raises-the-bar...

There are many others.

As for cost, cooler is better and lower G Max is better. The question is whether you want to improve athlete safety or not. Obviously OU does with the inclusion of a high quality pad which is a good thing.

I will give you this though, grooming is important and is neglected in most cases sometimes totally neglected.


Unless I missed it,the article you posted doesn't say anything about a any cancer case being attributed to crumb rubber.

As I posted,"crumb rubber" has been used as infill since the early 90's,with no cancer cases linked to it.

Also been used for "Fall Protection" for playgrounds.
Same thing,no cancer cases linked to it.

30 years or so,with no health issues ,is a pretty good track record.

Do you really think that, if they had even 1 cancer case attributed to "crumb rubber", it would still be being used ?

As far as "cooler is better",cooler is great,if you can afford it.
Not everyone can.

Many places down south "irrigate" synthetic turf to keep it cool.
Some school districts in places like Florida use a Aerial Tower to spray fields to keep them cool.

"Lower" GMax isn't what you're trying to achieve.

"Correct " G Max is what you have to achieve.

As I posted ,the correct GMax is determined based on sports the field is used for ,"Level" of play and other factors like weather.

Too low (soft) a GMax can be a problem, just like too hard.

You're looking for the GMax range for the field's design.

I wonder how many natural turf fields could pass a GMax test ?

As I posted,the proper GMax is accomplished with the correct thickness and mixture of infill.
Did it on every field I designed.

"Shock Pads" are used where the infill alone will not give you the specified GMax.

That's the case with Cool Play and natural infill and other synthetic turfs that use less infill.
You have to use a "shock pad".

A "shock Pad" being needed to achieve proper GMax doesn't mean the field is any safer.
It just means you had to follow a different path to get the same end point.

The "safety component" is identical.

What's interesting is that there is no evidence that a "shock pad" reduces concussions.

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Kinggeorge4
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/13/2022 7:54:11 AM 

I took some photos too. I saw a big group of rolls covered in a white plastic off to the side of the one end zone. Maybe they are getting to put in the turf?


GO BOBCATS
GEORGE

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Has the new field been installed?
   Posted: 7/13/2022 12:08:04 PM 
Kinggeorge4 wrote:
I took some photos too. I saw a big group of rolls covered in a white plastic off to the side of the one end zone. Maybe they are getting to put in the turf?





The white bags in the "bottom" photo are most likely "infill".

Synthetic turf rolls look like "carpet".


Last Edited: 7/13/2022 12:09:09 PM by rpbobcat

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