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Topic:  RE: Extend Tim Albin

Topic:  RE: Extend Tim Albin
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BillyTheCat
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Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 8,670

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 8:57:32 AM 
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.


There was NOT close to 4700 people at that game. I know you don't set the attendance, just stating, that figure is a joke.
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BillyTheCat
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Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 8,670

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 8:58:47 AM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.



I'm with you Al, I love Athens, but you can't compare it to Boone.
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Campus Flow
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 4,683

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 11:21:21 AM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Alan Swank
General User

Member Since: 12/11/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 6,716

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 12:16:59 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.

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Campus Flow
General User



Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 4,683

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 1:58:15 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.


Enrollment is going back up. The university recently approved a $200 million dollar package to finish the dorm renovations. Peden could have a bigger, better student section so the kids have plenty of concessions and don't have to sit on the hill for big games. They after all are paying a student fee and should get something for it. Some of that student fee could be used to pay for it.

Last Edited: 1/15/2023 1:59:19 PM by Campus Flow


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Alan Swank
General User

Member Since: 12/11/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 6,716

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 2:35:51 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.


Enrollment is going back up. The university recently approved a $200 million dollar package to finish the dorm renovations. Peden could have a bigger, better student section so the kids have plenty of concessions and don't have to sit on the hill for big games. They after all are paying a student fee and should get something for it. Some of that student fee could be used to pay for it.


Not sure where you're getting your figures but this chart from OU shows undergraduate Athens enrollment declining ever year since 2018 and for 2022 it was down again to 14,684.

https://www.ohio.edu/iea/student-data/enrollment/levelenr...

Again, how could it have a "bigger, better student section" when the student body doesn't fill the entire student side as it is?

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Campus Flow
General User



Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 4,683

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 3:31:58 PM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.


Enrollment is going back up. The university recently approved a $200 million dollar package to finish the dorm renovations. Peden could have a bigger, better student section so the kids have plenty of concessions and don't have to sit on the hill for big games. They after all are paying a student fee and should get something for it. Some of that student fee could be used to pay for it.


Not sure where you're getting your figures but this chart from OU shows undergraduate Athens enrollment declining ever year since 2018 and for 2022 it was down again to 14,684.

https://www.ohio.edu/iea/student-data/enrollment/levelenr...

Again, how could it have a "bigger, better student section" when the student body doesn't fill the entire student side as it is?


Its heading back to 16,000 Alan there was a record class last year.

I truly believe for some of those big games the students that are forced to sit on the mound or stand don't come back.

The larger point here is the university hasn't appeared very serious providing the very best possible with regard to athletic facilities. McDavis did say the university wanted to strengthen the academic footprint first and that is what they've done with the new STEM buildings and now the dorms have been renovated. Ridges as we discussed is going down the private-partnership route for the remaining of its redevelopment.

This leaves the athletics mall as the remaining area that is underdeveloped. As Ohio69 said it depends on what the next president at OU wants to do but since there isn't anything else to do we might hear something on the athletics facilities front relatively soon. Nothing else is going to make a difference and if the course of action is to do nothing it becomes a choice of doing nothing or doing something.

I'm saying do something if you can rather than do nothing. Hobble along with one working hydro pool and do nothing about. Don't fortify Boals and TA's programs with enhanced facilities. Its not necessarily wrong to do nothing but I'm offering a perspective of trying to do something instead of waiting forever. UC made a decision 30 years ago they were going to invest heavily in athletics and it paid off.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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giacomo
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Member Since: 11/20/2007
Post Count: 2,356

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 7:42:00 PM 
Youre ignoring the Athens market and the fact that attendance is not strong, even when we win. Its like a young person buying a big house, Rolex and a Mercedes now, hoping to someday have a job that can pay for it. Our facilities are just fine and our coaches are the top paid employees of the university.
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SBH
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 3,345

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 9:15:14 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.


Enrollment is going back up. The university recently approved a $200 million dollar package to finish the dorm renovations. Peden could have a bigger, better student section so the kids have plenty of concessions and don't have to sit on the hill for big games. They after all are paying a student fee and should get something for it. Some of that student fee could be used to pay for it.


Not sure where you're getting your figures but this chart from OU shows undergraduate Athens enrollment declining ever year since 2018 and for 2022 it was down again to 14,684.

https://www.ohio.edu/iea/student-data/enrollment/levelenr...

Again, how could it have a "bigger, better student section" when the student body doesn't fill the entire student side as it is?


Its heading back to 16,000 Alan there was a record class last year.

I truly believe for some of those big games the students that are forced to sit on the mound or stand don't come back.

The larger point here is the university hasn't appeared very serious providing the very best possible with regard to athletic facilities. McDavis did say the university wanted to strengthen the academic footprint first and that is what they've done with the new STEM buildings and now the dorms have been renovated. Ridges as we discussed is going down the private-partnership route for the remaining of its redevelopment.

This leaves the athletics mall as the remaining area that is underdeveloped. As Ohio69 said it depends on what the next president at OU wants to do but since there isn't anything else to do we might hear something on the athletics facilities front relatively soon. Nothing else is going to make a difference and if the course of action is to do nothing it becomes a choice of doing nothing or doing something.

I'm saying do something if you can rather than do nothing. Hobble along with one working hydro pool and do nothing about. Don't fortify Boals and TA's programs with enhanced facilities. Its not necessarily wrong to do nothing but I'm offering a perspective of trying to do something instead of waiting forever. UC made a decision 30 years ago they were going to invest heavily in athletics and it paid off.



The new hydrotherapy pools are expected to cost $900k minimum. They are actively raising the money. Why not donate a few shekels?
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Campus Flow
General User



Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 4,683

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/15/2023 10:18:37 PM 
SBH wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
giacomo wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:
If OU is the only G5 program to win a game in the last 3 NCAA Tournaments no doubt that is notable success.

Likewise OU has won 6 bowls since 2011 which is more than any other MAC school in that time period including 4-0 against the Mountain West in bowls the most regarded G5 conference.

The problem in football and basketball is not success but a problem of perception since the program hasn't gone full throttle on facilities as a Memphis or Boise State to give themselves separation within the conference.

If Toledo (Spain) has more well known and so is Kent (England) perhaps OU should change its name to Lyon and then everyone would know who we are. There are so many schools in Ohio that when you say the word "Ohio" they often think a place within Ohio rather than Ohio University proper.


Then why do we only draw 4700 for a Friday night game with the first place team in the MAC? It has nothing to do with facilities and going in on the arms race as you suggest. Athens is a small metro market and if the surrounding townspeople and students don't attend, this is where we are. They obviously don't really care and it shows in attendance. If we sold out the games maybe we could justify the spending on facilities and coaches,

Scheduling basketball games that compete with local high schools and football games during the week don't help. The stands are empty on the MACtion weeknight games everywhere, not just in Athens. Read the writing on the wall. We are who we are.



Appalachian State is in a small metro market but they've invested in facilities so its assumed they are a bigger G5 job though they don't pay the HC a lot.



Have you been to Boone lately? Comparing Boone to Athens is like comparing apples and oranges not to mention the fact that ASU doesn't sit in the shadow of a Big 10 team. Wake Forest is no competition and UT and VT are in different states.


All I'm talking about Alan is trying to have the best facilities in place for the program that it could have. It could have a basketball practice facility and it could have a better student section at the football stadium. The Convo at the time it was built was the most state of the art arena possible at that time.


How exactly would "a better student section" at the football stadium matter? For that matter, what would a better student section look like? As far as the practice facility goes, we have a court in the Convo and 5 in Ping. When enrollment, ie student fees, are going down, why not use existing resources.


Enrollment is going back up. The university recently approved a $200 million dollar package to finish the dorm renovations. Peden could have a bigger, better student section so the kids have plenty of concessions and don't have to sit on the hill for big games. They after all are paying a student fee and should get something for it. Some of that student fee could be used to pay for it.


Not sure where you're getting your figures but this chart from OU shows undergraduate Athens enrollment declining ever year since 2018 and for 2022 it was down again to 14,684.

https://www.ohio.edu/iea/student-data/enrollment/levelenr...

Again, how could it have a "bigger, better student section" when the student body doesn't fill the entire student side as it is?


Its heading back to 16,000 Alan there was a record class last year.

I truly believe for some of those big games the students that are forced to sit on the mound or stand don't come back.

The larger point here is the university hasn't appeared very serious providing the very best possible with regard to athletic facilities. McDavis did say the university wanted to strengthen the academic footprint first and that is what they've done with the new STEM buildings and now the dorms have been renovated. Ridges as we discussed is going down the private-partnership route for the remaining of its redevelopment.

This leaves the athletics mall as the remaining area that is underdeveloped. As Ohio69 said it depends on what the next president at OU wants to do but since there isn't anything else to do we might hear something on the athletics facilities front relatively soon. Nothing else is going to make a difference and if the course of action is to do nothing it becomes a choice of doing nothing or doing something.

I'm saying do something if you can rather than do nothing. Hobble along with one working hydro pool and do nothing about. Don't fortify Boals and TA's programs with enhanced facilities. Its not necessarily wrong to do nothing but I'm offering a perspective of trying to do something instead of waiting forever. UC made a decision 30 years ago they were going to invest heavily in athletics and it paid off.



The new hydrotherapy pools are expected to cost $900k minimum. They are actively raising the money. Why not donate a few shekels?


Hydro pool repair should be a sunk cost as part of the athletic department. If they had a basketball practice facility with 4 of them it wouldn't be so urgent to be down to 1 for the entire athletic department. Going to donors for everything takes forever.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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SBH
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 3,345

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/16/2023 9:35:35 AM 
We have hydrotherapy pools for "indoor" sports...at the Convo.

The pools and surrounding infrastructure in Peden need to be gutted. They serve football, cross country, etc.

Just saying it should be a "sunk" cost for ICA doesn't magically make the funds appear. The donation stream to Ohio Athletics is pathetic.

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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/16/2023 11:37:10 AM 
We have hydro pools at the Convo? That is the first I've heard of it but its good news.

Admittedly the donation stream for athletics is not strong but further does the university want to redirect giving from academics to athletics? Then of course NIL is coming in to further dilute the pie.

How many donors chipped in for the original construction of Peden? The university paid for it out of its own money. The university might have to dig in 20 million to give the stadium a real upgrade. Make it 60 million for a new aquatics center, basketball practice facility and Peden upgrade.

Its impossible for the current administration. But the campus master plan is due for a redesign in 2025-26. Will the BPF on the master plan in 2016 still be showing in 2026? What about the addition of an new aquatic center to Ping on the 2016 master plan? Aquatic Center turns 50 in 2034. The university is right at the moment to kick the can down the road at the moment but by the latter half of the decade I expect they'll be some movement on new athletic projects.


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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/16/2023 6:44:47 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:
We have hydro pools at the Convo? That is the first I've heard of it but its good news.

Admittedly the donation stream for athletics is not strong but further does the university want to redirect giving from academics to athletics? Then of course NIL is coming in to further dilute the pie.

How many donors chipped in for the original construction of Peden? The university paid for it out of its own money. The university might have to dig in 20 million to give the stadium a real upgrade. Make it 60 million for a new aquatics center, basketball practice facility and Peden upgrade.

Its impossible for the current administration. But the campus master plan is due for a redesign in 2025-26. Will the BPF on the master plan in 2016 still be showing in 2026? What about the addition of an new aquatic center to Ping on the 2016 master plan? Aquatic Center turns 50 in 2034. The university is right at the moment to kick the can down the road at the moment but by the latter half of the decade I expect they'll be some movement on new athletic projects.


Yes, we have hydro pools at the Convo, they were installed when with the training room renovation. The Peden pools, are old and outdated and need replaced.
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DC_United47
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/21/2023 5:46:43 PM 
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

Let me explain the 2023 outlook:
Leading passer (and MAC POTY) is back. Backup is bowl game MVP.
Top 9 of 10 receivers are back including MAC first-teammer Wiglusz.
Top 4 leading rushers are back including MAC FR of the year.
Leading tacklers and leading sack getters are back.
Defense returns three starting linebackers, two starting corners, best DT and best DE.
Hardest game next year is Iowa State at home.
Only MAC losses in 2022 were in OT or championship game
We play 5-7 FAU, 7-6 SDSU, and 4-7 LIU non-conference

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?

Last Edited: 1/21/2023 5:49:14 PM by DC_United47

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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 12:53:43 PM 
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

Let me explain the 2023 outlook:
Leading passer (and MAC POTY) is back. Backup is bowl game MVP.
Top 9 of 10 receivers are back including MAC first-teammer Wiglusz.
Top 4 leading rushers are back including MAC FR of the year.
Leading tacklers and leading sack getters are back.
Defense returns three starting linebackers, two starting corners, best DT and best DE.
Hardest game next year is Iowa State at home.
Only MAC losses in 2022 were in OT or championship game
We play 5-7 FAU, 7-6 SDSU, and 4-7 LIU non-conference

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?

Agree 100% DC!!

Last Edited: 1/22/2023 12:54:24 PM by Bobcat1996

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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 1:28:06 PM 
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?


In what world do you think Albin would turn down Tulane to stay at OU... just because we extended him out to 2026...?

Give him a lifetime contract, if you want. The first P5 that calls, hes picking up the phone and I wouldn't blame him for one second.

You think PJ Fleck would've stayed at Western Michigan just because they extended him...? I bet you think strippers like you for your personality.
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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 5:13:50 PM 
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

Let me explain the 2023 outlook:
Leading passer (and MAC POTY) is back. Backup is bowl game MVP.
Top 9 of 10 receivers are back including MAC first-teammer Wiglusz.
Top 4 leading rushers are back including MAC FR of the year.
Leading tacklers and leading sack getters are back.
Defense returns three starting linebackers, two starting corners, best DT and best DE.
Hardest game next year is Iowa State at home.
Only MAC losses in 2022 were in OT or championship game
We play 5-7 FAU, 7-6 SDSU, and 4-7 LIU non-conference

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?


What you fundamentally don't understand is how pay works in the mid major conferences.

In the mid majors when a coach does something like win a bowl or a conference championship they are then deemed worthy enough to receive an extension to put their pay package near or at the top of the conference. For example the lower paid coaches in the MAC make around 500,000 and the better ones make around 1 million.

When that said coach making the 1 million leaves for a better offer somewhere else the same school typically starts the next guy over at 500,000 to avoid the risk the next staff isn't successful and is overpaid. When the previous coach was raised to 1 million it also resets the buyout higher to 1 million so by leaving the school receives back that buyout which is a net positive.

Its the same thing in basketball wtih mid major leagues like the MAC, A10 and MVC where the more senior/successful coaches have a bigger salary and the newer entrants are paid toward the lower end of the scale.

That is why I'm saying the path to build up your program is to extend a coach (when he deserves it) to put his salary up in the Top 3 of the conference (which also pumps up the buyout). TA is 13-13 with 2 more years on his contract so I think extending him is premature IMO.

Boals I don't understand what is going on there with his program. What has hurt him with an extension IMO has been the pandemic and university struggling during that time with the president quitting and now we have an interim president who is expected to resign in the next 6 months.

For some of the presidential churn reasons athletics may be kept quiet so the next president can make his mark on the department. To me its perfectly fine to wait another 6 or 9 months on coaching extensions given the situation in Cutler Hall. Boals also is not having a great year so far so that delays the urgency on his end for an extension.

Last Edited: 1/22/2023 5:17:10 PM by Campus Flow


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2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 5:14:17 PM 
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?


In what world do you think Albin would turn down Tulane to stay at OU... just because we extended him out to 2026...?

Give him a lifetime contract, if you want. The first P5 that calls, hes picking up the phone and I wouldn't blame him for one second.

You think PJ Fleck would've stayed at Western Michigan just because they extended him...? I bet you think strippers like you for your personality.

The point is that not all people are the same. Fleck was never looking to stay at WMU. What are Albin's goals? Does he love Athens? He is certainly making enough that he can live comfortably in Athens the rest of his life, if that is his goal. Or, is he looking for a quick exit, looking for the bright lights and big bucks of the big city?

I don't know him at all, but if there is a possibility that he loves Athens, the best way to keep him there is for him to be treated fairly and with respect, and to give him job security.


We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak. ― Epictetus

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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 5:24:29 PM 
Coaching salaries always have a risk involved that the coach doesn't pan out and will have to be replaced. Its great when you can get into a Solich type situation where he delivered for an extended time and was for a while at least the highest paid coach in the MAC.

Its facilities pay the longer term dividends for a program. All the best G5 recruiting programs have put in better facilities. Fiami's recruiting shot up when the put in that new football operations facility. Ohio's recruiting didn't improve that much but I think its development did with the IPF as the offensive output has jumped since 2014.


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2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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DC_United47
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/22/2023 9:05:41 PM 
L.C. wrote:
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?


In what world do you think Albin would turn down Tulane to stay at OU... just because we extended him out to 2026...?

Give him a lifetime contract, if you want. The first P5 that calls, hes picking up the phone and I wouldn't blame him for one second.

You think PJ Fleck would've stayed at Western Michigan just because they extended him...? I bet you think strippers like you for your personality.

The point is that not all people are the same. Fleck was never looking to stay at WMU. What are Albin's goals? Does he love Athens? He is certainly making enough that he can live comfortably in Athens the rest of his life, if that is his goal. Or, is he looking for a quick exit, looking for the bright lights and big bucks of the big city?

I don't know him at all, but if there is a possibility that he loves Athens, the best way to keep him there is for him to be treated fairly and with respect, and to give him job security.


I dont know Albin either, but Id be willing to bet the guy from rural Oklahoma whos spent his whole adult life in Athens, Fargo, and Lincoln is just fine without the bright lights and big bucks of the big city.

Frank was hired in 2005 when he was about 55. Albin was hired in 2021 when he was like 55. I could see him staying a long time in the head coach role. His kids grew up in Athens. Hes been here the whole time with Frank. I imagine he likes it enough to turn down a marginally better offer from a marginally better program. Its just a matter of Ohio making sure what he has here is in the ballpark of that offer when it comes. And given what he has coming back in 2023 I bet that offer comes by Thanksgiving. If someone doubles my salary Im gone too! Ill move to Mars I dont care. But if its for 10% or 20% more? And my wife and kids like it here? And I have to leave the place Ive been for 20 years? Well thats different.

No one is saying Albin wont leave for a P5 school that doubles his pay. Were not in the same league as those jobs practically. But if we extend him and give a raise to market value, we can likely stave off a run by some low lever P5 or better G5 school that wants to offer him 20% more to start all over somewhere new.
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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/23/2023 2:47:29 PM 
DC_United47 wrote:
L.C. wrote:
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
DC_United47 wrote:
This thread has gone off the rails! LOL

Extending Tim Albin is not exclusively about rewarding past performance at market value. Its also about making sure hes OUr coach in 2024.

If we dont extend TA and give significant support to the program, this team is going to rip off 10 wins again and hell go to Tulane or App State and take everyone with him. Some place we think were the same as but were really not.

Then well be stuck in mediocre MAC limbo like BGSU has been since Dino, WMU has been since Fleck, and Akron, and Eastern, and Kent.

Its not about 2022 or 2023. Its about 2024 and beyond. How long do we want to be this good?


In what world do you think Albin would turn down Tulane to stay at OU... just because we extended him out to 2026...?

Give him a lifetime contract, if you want. The first P5 that calls, hes picking up the phone and I wouldn't blame him for one second.

You think PJ Fleck would've stayed at Western Michigan just because they extended him...? I bet you think strippers like you for your personality.

The point is that not all people are the same. Fleck was never looking to stay at WMU. What are Albin's goals? Does he love Athens? He is certainly making enough that he can live comfortably in Athens the rest of his life, if that is his goal. Or, is he looking for a quick exit, looking for the bright lights and big bucks of the big city?

I don't know him at all, but if there is a possibility that he loves Athens, the best way to keep him there is for him to be treated fairly and with respect, and to give him job security.


I dont know Albin either, but Id be willing to bet the guy from rural Oklahoma whos spent his whole adult life in Athens, Fargo, and Lincoln is just fine without the bright lights and big bucks of the big city.

Frank was hired in 2005 when he was about 55. Albin was hired in 2021 when he was like 55. I could see him staying a long time in the head coach role. His kids grew up in Athens. Hes been here the whole time with Frank. I imagine he likes it enough to turn down a marginally better offer from a marginally better program. Its just a matter of Ohio making sure what he has here is in the ballpark of that offer when it comes. And given what he has coming back in 2023 I bet that offer comes by Thanksgiving. If someone doubles my salary Im gone too! Ill move to Mars I dont care. But if its for 10% or 20% more? And my wife and kids like it here? And I have to leave the place Ive been for 20 years? Well thats different.

No one is saying Albin wont leave for a P5 school that doubles his pay. Were not in the same league as those jobs practically. But if we extend him and give a raise to market value, we can likely stave off a run by some low lever P5 or better G5 school that wants to offer him 20% more to start all over somewhere new.


Coaches can be fired before conference championship week but the hiring decisions are made after. Extend Albin next year if he has a winning season going into championship week. There isn't any risk of him moving elsewhere before that and beyond that risk is low unless he wins the MAC.

Boals maybe with an extension by the end of the summer with a new OU president on board. He only has 1 more year and Albin has 2.


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2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/24/2023 1:05:23 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:

Coaches can be fired before conference championship week but the hiring decisions are made after. Extend Albin next year if he has a winning season going into championship week. There isn't any risk of him moving elsewhere before that and beyond that risk is low unless he wins the MAC.

Boals maybe with an extension by the end of the summer with a new OU president on board. He only has 1 more year and Albin has 2.


It might not matter in the grand scheme, but that Boals extension is looking *a lot* more manageable after this season.
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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/24/2023 4:08:59 PM 
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
Campus Flow wrote:

Coaches can be fired before conference championship week but the hiring decisions are made after. Extend Albin next year if he has a winning season going into championship week. There isn't any risk of him moving elsewhere before that and beyond that risk is low unless he wins the MAC.

Boals maybe with an extension by the end of the summer with a new OU president on board. He only has 1 more year and Albin has 2.


It might not matter in the grand scheme, but that Boals extension is looking *a lot* more manageable after this season.


3 year extension plus 100k raise should be sufficient. Also bump up the assistants. Unless the season completely tanks from this point forward. Trajectory at the moment is winning record and cracks additional wins in Cleveland + CBI/CIT.


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2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/26/2023 11:47:15 AM 
L.C. wrote:
This is what I found on MAC coaches pay, compiles from a variety of sources, so it may not be accurate:

1. Candle, Toledo $1.1
2. Taylor, WMU $850k
3. McElwain, CMU $840k
4. Linguist, Buffalo $675k
5. Hammock, NIU $631k
6. Creighton, EMU $540k
7. Burns, Kent $540k
8. Martin, Miami $533k
9. Albin, Ohio $531k
10. Loeffler, BG $525k
11. Moorhead, Akron $500k
12. Neu, Ball State $453k
..

Based on research I did for another thread, it appears that in addition to Loeffler, Moorhead, and Neu, there are two other coaches in FBS making less than Albin, and interestingly, both are former MAC coaches:
Chuck Martin, New Mexico St, $437k
Terry Bowden, ULM, $430k

Thus, the bottom 6 coaches in FBS are:
Bowden, 430k
Martin 437K
Neu 453k
Moorhead 500k
Loeffler 525k
Albin 531k




We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak. ― Epictetus

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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: Extend Tim Albin
   Posted: 1/26/2023 12:51:51 PM 
Coach Albin will get an extension and it could be that this Bobcat Attack board will be the last to find out. I doubt Ohio University administration gives a rats blankety blank what this message board thinks.
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