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Topic:  What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?

Topic:  What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
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OhioBobcat
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  Message Not Read  What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/27/2023 2:52:32 PM 

 
 
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Which of the choices in this poll matters most to YOU?
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Casper71
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/27/2023 6:13:02 PM 
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/27/2023 6:40:54 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


If winning the conference is so important, why did we name the field after a coach who never won the conference?
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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/27/2023 6:44:29 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


Are we being held back in recruiting or national perspective having not won it?

Cause I think we're doing okay for ourselves over the last two decades. There isn't a single soul going to Ball State over OU just because they won the MACC two years ago.

Everyone wants to win it, of course, but it doesn't bother me that we haven't in my Dad's lifetime.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/27/2023 7:05:20 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


I'd be interested in what the three people who say beating Miami and the two people who said winning a bowl game is more important than a MAC championship have to say.

Last Edited: 12/27/2023 7:05:55 PM by Alan Swank

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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 8:39:34 AM 
For me personally, I want the football program to win every game they play. However, I realize that is probably not going to happen. To achieve the goal of winning the league, Miami is usually in the way, so it is very important to beat them. To earn a top 25 ranking, they probably need to knock off a power five team and win the rest of the games. If it comes down to winning a conference championship with a 7-6 record or ending the season 12-2 with a bowl win, then I will take the 12 win season every day.

"Are we being held back in recruiting or national perspective having not won it?

Cause I think we're doing okay for ourselves over the last two decades. There isn't a single soul going to Ball State over OU just because they won the MACC two years ago."

MDWST brings up a good point. Ohio doesn't seem to be losing any recruits because they have not won a conference championship. Sure the youth of today want to win a league championship, but that isn't the end all be all like it is for so many old folks.

Last Edited: 12/28/2023 9:07:48 AM by Bobcat1996

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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 10:41:38 AM 
I will posit that all of the above are reasonable goals, but that the value placed on each will at least partly be dependent on how recently they it was last accomplished. Since the item that has been the longest time since it was accomplished is a MACC, that is the most highly valued objective. Since a double digit win season and a bowl win have been most recently accomplished, they are less highly valued. Had Ohio won the MACC this year, "win the MACC" would have a lower value, while goals like "beating a top 25 team" or "being ranked in the top 25" would be more highly valued.


ďWe have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.Ē ― Epictetus

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Campus Flow
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 11:36:31 AM 
I put more value into an 11+ win season something Ohio hasn't accomplished than another 10 season which I will take over a 9 win season of course every time.

The roadies matter to me the most because I can plan vacations around them. I was going to mention in the possible optimism thread before that was destroyed with bickering. Syracuse next year will be 78 degrees on 8/31 with the game played in a dome so good cottage opportunity. A game at UK is another crack at the Burbon trail and this one is at the end of September so could have reasonable weather. I've made the bowl games into vacations more than a few times.

For those that want FCS all that goes away. Instead its a playoff game on the road in Montana and a road game at a G5 at best. Recruiting classes rated in the low 200s.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 12:48:12 PM 
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


Are we being held back in recruiting or national perspective having not won it?

Cause I think we're doing okay for ourselves over the last two decades. There isn't a single soul going to Ball State over OU just because they won the MACC two years ago.

Everyone wants to win it, of course, but it doesn't bother me that we haven't in my Dad's lifetime.


Halloween in Athens might outweigh a MAC trophy in recruiting.

We're talking about recruiting 17, 18, 19 year olds up to 21 year old transfers.

Us older folks love a good trophy because we didn't grow up in the "everybody gets a trophy!" era of youth sports. Today's young people did.

Thus we need them to win so we can vicariously appreciate the trophy through them. Five straight bowl wins is good in the trophy department.

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Casper71
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 1:10:22 PM 
Billy, you didnít answer the question. My question was if youíre in a conference wouldnít the whole goal be to win it? Who cares who the field is named after. The question is do you wanna win a championship or donít you. Donít ask me to answer the question why havenít we won one? Karma, lack of athletes, lack of coaches, lack of facilities, lack of money, could be any or all of these. Or something else. Location?

Last Edited: 12/28/2023 1:11:54 PM by Casper71

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BryanHall
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 3:01:17 PM 
Casper71 wrote:
Billy, you didnít answer the question. My question was if youíre in a conference wouldnít the whole goal be to win it? Who cares who the field is named after. The question is do you wanna win a championship or donít you. Donít ask me to answer the question why havenít we won one? Karma, lack of athletes, lack of coaches, lack of facilities, lack of money, could be any or all of these. Or something else. Location?


Do you think anyone rationalized the importance of the MAC championship away? For example, as long as we are good this isn't important. I'd actually like to see this poll without the MAC championship as an option.
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MonroeClassmate
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 6:56:10 PM 
IMO the Bobcats have never won a MAC because they haven't had the focus to pull it off when they had the opportunity to win it all. Much like the Cleveland Indians making it to several World Series but not winning it when they were there.

Atlanta, with their fantastic pitching staff was better than the Tribe and it would have been an upset to beat them and much like the Bobcats in Detroit against CMU.

But when the Tribe had their star closer on the mound against the Marlins he simply choked and didn't throw the pitches the catcher was calling for and there goes the game 7. Or later against the Red Sox and having a 3-1 lead in games and simply couldn't close it out and then Boston sweeps a very weak Colorado team in 4 games and the Tribe probably could have put away as well. Then even later, the Cubs are treated to little league defensive errors in game 5 or 6 by the Tribe and then in game 7 after Raja Davis ties it against Chapman. And immediately following that, Crisp and another have solid singles putting two on with two out. Chapman had totally lost his composure. The worthless Jan Gomes stepped up and the first two pitches were NO WHERE near the plate and didn't make it the 60'6" to cross the plate, you have the pitcher shaking in his boots having given up the game tying bomb, then two quick hard singles and now he cannot get the ball over the plate and is 2-0 on Gomes. What would a great manager and a good pro do with a two ball count in that situation? How about a sign to take a pitch or do it on your own? Well Gomes, likely wanting to be a hero, swings at ball 3, then swings at ball 4 as well as ball 5 bailing out Chapman and the rally ends and Cleveland's best chance to win drifts right out the door. Players not making plays when a play was needed.

And so it is with OUr Bobcats. Up 20-0 on NIU in Detroit at the half and then they follow the Indians examples by players not making routine plays. Three stick out in my mind during the 2nd half. Remember, a little bit of drain on the 2nd half clock and OT would have been highly unlikely. NIU with the ball and QB throws one to the right flats. Bobcat DB jumps the route and with hands of stone, drops a sure interception and a very likely pick 6; NIU scores on this drive. Next, TT has a receiver wide open, not for a huge gain but a completion to move the sticks and burn clock. TT overthrows the receiver giving the receiver no chance to get his hands on the ball. Then OUr punter who had been solid all season and when a forty yard punt is needed has the ball go off the side of his foot and shanks one that barely gets back to the line of scrimmage. NIU with good field position and little time, moves in for the tie. Any one of these simple routine plays goes OHIO's way and the MAC would have been in Athens for the year. (May have beaten OSU too minus a muffed punt) Players have got to make plays when the opportunity is there--not Raja Davis type plays, just the plays that they've likely made hundreds of times.

Contrast this with Bobcat Basketball and making it to the dance the players have done what was needed to win NCAA Dance games on several occasions!

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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/28/2023 8:27:36 PM 
Campus Flow wrote:
I put more value into an 11+ win season something Ohio hasn't accomplished than another 10 season which I will take over a 9 win season of course every time.

The roadies matter to me the most because I can plan vacations around them. I was going to mention in the possible optimism thread before that was destroyed with bickering. Syracuse next year will be 78 degrees on 8/31 with the game played in a dome so good cottage opportunity. A game at UK is another crack at the Burbon trail and this one is at the end of September so could have reasonable weather. I've made the bowl games into vacations more than a few times.

For those that want FCS all that goes away. Instead its a playoff game on the road in Montana and a road game at a G5 at best. Recruiting classes rated in the low 200s.


Great post Campus Flow!
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Bobcats1212
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/29/2023 12:51:48 AM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


If winning the conference is so important, why did we name the field after a coach who never won the conference?


Because Frank is overrated and OU is fine just winning a bowl gameÖ
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Bobcat Jerry
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/29/2023 9:58:36 AM 
Agree with last comment !
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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/29/2023 7:27:16 PM 
In football what does a conference championship get the league winner? A bowl opportunity in Boise, Florida, Arizona or Alabama? All wonderful spots, but what does it really get the winner? Does it bring in better recruits? Does the league give the conference winning school five million dollars? Possibly the league winning coach earns more money if they take another job at a power five school?? Maybe alums will donate a little more cash to the league winning university? Now that the portal is the top priority, will NIL donations increase? Will stadium, locker room and weight room facilities improve?

Last Edited: 12/29/2023 7:35:07 PM by Bobcat1996

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77 Mulberry
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/29/2023 7:28:21 PM 
We have! Actually 5 but the last one was 1968 so it seems irrelevant to talk about such ancient achievements.
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mid70sbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/29/2023 10:59:57 PM 
Bobcats1212 wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:
Casper71 wrote:
Why would we be in a conference and not want to win it?


If winning the conference is so important, why did we name the field after a coach who never won the conference?


Because Frank is overrated and OU is fine just winning a bowl gameÖ


Oh sure, definitely overrated, no doubt. Look at his failures. He followed Tom Osborne at Nebraska, but I'll assume you have no clue who Osborne was. Frank in 6 years there, had a horrible record, with 3 1st's, 2 2nd's and a 4th in 6 seasons in the Big 12. What he did at Ohio was that he continued to be mediocre and overrated, as you state. From 1978 to Frank's arrival in 2005 did we have a coach with a winning record? No, Bob Kappes, Brian Burke, Cleve Bryant, Tom Lichtenburg, Jim Grobe, Brian Knorr all failed to win more games than they lost. They were 95-189, or an awesome winning percentage of 33 percent. Frank let us all down by winning a measly 58 percent of overall games and 62 percent MAC games.

I sometimes wonder about posters who seem to be detached from reality.



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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/30/2023 8:13:54 AM 
Casper71 wrote:
Billy, you didnít answer the question. My question was if youíre in a conference wouldnít the whole goal be to win it? Who cares who the field is named after. The question is do you wanna win a championship or donít you. Donít ask me to answer the question why havenít we won one? Karma, lack of athletes, lack of coaches, lack of facilities, lack of money, could be any or all of these. Or something else. Location?


Of course, the goal is to always win. Find me a coach and a player, who wanted to lose. It's a silly question, #1 on a Goal Board is win the conference championship, it's actually the only thing that is in your control. You cannot control rankings, your Bowl game, your Bowl opponent. Sorry, I did not answer your question, I felt, winning the league is a given.
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Kevin Finnegan
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/30/2023 12:27:19 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
Casper71 wrote:
Billy, you didnít answer the question. My question was if youíre in a conference wouldnít the whole goal be to win it? Who cares who the field is named after. The question is do you wanna win a championship or donít you. Donít ask me to answer the question why havenít we won one? Karma, lack of athletes, lack of coaches, lack of facilities, lack of money, could be any or all of these. Or something else. Location?


Of course, the goal is to always win. Find me a coach and a player, who wanted to lose. It's a silly question, #1 on a Goal Board is win the conference championship, it's actually the only thing that is in your control. You cannot control rankings, your Bowl game, your Bowl opponent. Sorry, I did not answer your question, I felt, winning the league is a given.


Youíre not wrong that that should be the answer to a player or coach, but the post is about what matters most to the average fan. I think that a top 25 ranking is more important to me (though that likely means we are in position for a conference championship). Many of my friends are not OHIO alums but we are always talking sports. Wouldnít give fan bragging rights if my Bobcats went 7-5 but won the conference. Having a ranked season is much better for the fan experience weekly, waiting to see the poll come out and see how much we moved up/down and staying in the national spotlight. Rankings mean a lot to recruits and donors as well.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/30/2023 2:01:12 PM 
If you look up in the Convo you see banners for championship seasons. In Peden we see the equivalent of decals you'd put on the back of your camper from various vacation spots. That is not a knock against football but a conference championship and a bowl appearance are as different as night and day.
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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/30/2023 6:16:19 PM 
This university is a basketball first and football second university. Football has won outright or tied for the regular season at least two times in the last 17 seasons. For some reason, regular season banners are allowed in the Convo, but not in Peden. Most of those banners hanging since 1993 are for a tournament championship. The basketball team wins three games in March, where in some cases all 12 teams get invited to the year end tourney. Totally different story for football. They have to be one of the top two teams in the regular season. When is the last time Ohio basketball has finished one of the top two teams in basketball during the regular season? Jim Christian was the coach and the Zips from Akron were the top seed. Basketball wouldn't be invited to the tourney if they used the same criteria as football. Since 2006, Ohio football has a better regular season record in conference play than basketball. However, since the majority of teams get included for a post season tourney then Ohio and most of the league gets an opportunity to win a three game tournament in March.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 12/31/2023 6:06:34 PM 
Bobcat1996 wrote:
This university is a basketball first and football second university. Football has won outright or tied for the regular season at least two times in the last 17 seasons. For some reason, regular season banners are allowed in the Convo, but not in Peden. Most of those banners hanging since 1993 are for a tournament championship. The basketball team wins three games in March, where in some cases all 12 teams get invited to the year end tourney. Totally different story for football. They have to be one of the top two teams in the regular season. When is the last time Ohio basketball has finished one of the top two teams in basketball during the regular season? Jim Christian was the coach and the Zips from Akron were the top seed. Basketball wouldn't be invited to the tourney if they used the same criteria as football. Since 2006, Ohio football has a better regular season record in conference play than basketball. However, since the majority of teams get included for a post season tourney then Ohio and most of the league gets an opportunity to win a three game tournament in March.


Don't mean to be harsh but, hanks for stating the obvious. If that was your term paper, you'd probably fail or m maybe not with today's grade inflation. Bottom line, we have hung championship banners in the Convo for each of two yearly chances that you get - regular season and tournament. In football, we have one chance and have not won a MAC championship since 1968. Hot sure where you came up with twice in the last 17 years. Division championships aren't conference championships. As for being a basketball school vs. a football school, that may have been the case in the 80s and 90s and in NCAA tournament appearance years, but that gap is continuing to close.

Last Edited: 12/31/2023 6:38:49 PM by Alan Swank

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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 1/1/2024 8:27:06 AM 
In 2006 the Bobcats and Central Michigan ended the regular season tied at 7-1. No other league school had 7 wins. In 2022 Ohio ended the regular season 7-1 with the next best conference team at 5-3. Basketball, baseball and softball hang banners for regular season accomplishments, like I mentioned above.

Last Edited: 1/1/2024 8:29:58 AM by Bobcat1996

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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: What matters most to you concerning Ohio football?
   Posted: 1/1/2024 10:06:49 AM 
Bobcat1996 wrote:
In 2006 the Bobcats and Central Michigan ended the regular season tied at 7-1. No other league school had 7 wins. In 2022 Ohio ended the regular season 7-1 with the next best conference team at 5-3. Basketball, baseball and softball hang banners for regular season accomplishments, like I mentioned above.


Those were division champs not conference in 2006 and 2022. The conference champ won the conference championship game. Big difference.
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