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Topic:  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th

Topic:  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/18/2024 12:42:07 PM 
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times
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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/18/2024 10:20:41 PM 
GoCats105 wrote:

I don't really understand the banking of a scholarship mentality but it feels like we've been doing that a lot lately.


Calipari has talked about only having 8-9 guys on scholarship going forward and he's not the only one thinking that way.

Reason? You aren't going to play more than that number significant minutes and nobody today wants to sit the bench. Why waste NIL $ and schollies/tuition let alone coaching and fitness and development time on guys who are just going to bolt and play against you?

Not sure I agree with it but offering an example where more and more schollies might start going unused.
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colobobcat66
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/19/2024 8:45:23 AM 
GraffZ06 wrote:
GoCats105 wrote:

I don't really understand the banking of a scholarship mentality but it feels like we've been doing that a lot lately.


Calipari has talked about only having 8-9 guys on scholarship going forward and he's not the only one thinking that way.

Reason? You aren't going to play more than that number significant minutes and nobody today wants to sit the bench. Why waste NIL $ and schollies/tuition let alone coaching and fitness and development time on guys who are just going to bolt and play against you?

Not sure I agree with it but offering an example where more and more schollies might start going unused.


Not sure this really applies much to our situation , Calipari is recruiting 4 and 5 star guys who will play or will bolt. Not exactly the same here. I also donít think we have to pay any/much NIL to many of the guys who are left now. I know it not necessarily easy to find the hidden gems, but thatís part of what these coaches are paid for . As far as how much it costs to take care of them, most of the money is already sunk costs and incremental costs are relatively minor.
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/19/2024 9:10:21 AM 
colobobcat66 wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
GoCats105 wrote:

I don't really understand the banking of a scholarship mentality but it feels like we've been doing that a lot lately.


Calipari has talked about only having 8-9 guys on scholarship going forward and he's not the only one thinking that way.

Reason? You aren't going to play more than that number significant minutes and nobody today wants to sit the bench. Why waste NIL $ and schollies/tuition let alone coaching and fitness and development time on guys who are just going to bolt and play against you?

Not sure I agree with it but offering an example where more and more schollies might start going unused.


Not sure this really applies much to our situation , Calipari is recruiting 4 and 5 star guys who will play or will bolt. Not exactly the same here. I also donít think we have to pay any/much NIL to many of the guys who are left now. I know it not necessarily easy to find the hidden gems, but thatís part of what these coaches are paid for . As far as how much it costs to take care of them, most of the money is already sunk costs and incremental costs are relatively minor.


Itís a good discussion. In our case, youíd think thereís another Searls out there (grad/upperclassman) looking to make the jump up for their final season or two that can help.

To your point, itís the staffís jobs to be able to identify these types.
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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/19/2024 12:01:00 PM 
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 9:58:42 AM 
GraffZ06 wrote:
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.


I'm cool with standards, but I doubt everyone remaining falls under those categories. We also took a chance on Paveletzke as a two-time transfer (Jason Carter too, if you count that). Point being, I'd like to think there are a few guys still unsigned worth bringing in that wouldn't be problems.

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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 10:33:16 AM 
Myle Foster to Clemson.
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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 12:54:06 PM 
FJC31 wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.


I'm cool with standards, but I doubt everyone remaining falls under those categories. We also took a chance on Paveletzke as a two-time transfer (Jason Carter too, if you count that). Point being, I'd like to think there are a few guys still unsigned worth bringing in that wouldn't be problems.



I can live with Paveletzke looking for quality PT.

It bothers me more in football when kids are coming into programs in May or June... not able to get up to speed... and then are back into the portal by December. THAT is a huge NCAA error that should be cleaned up.
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GoCats105
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 4:16:52 PM 
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.


I'm cool with standards, but I doubt everyone remaining falls under those categories. We also took a chance on Paveletzke as a two-time transfer (Jason Carter too, if you count that). Point being, I'd like to think there are a few guys still unsigned worth bringing in that wouldn't be problems.



I can live with Paveletzke looking for quality PT.

It bothers me more in football when kids are coming into programs in May or June... not able to get up to speed... and then are back into the portal by December. THAT is a huge NCAA error that should be cleaned up.


Or the flip side to that coin, which is what we just saw this spring. A bunch of guys transfer as soon as their season is over, join a new team and find out they're not going to be getting much PT during spring practice and the spring game, then end up in the portal again before the summer. So they'd be in 3 schools (or on 3 rosters) in less than a calendar year.
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shabamon
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 4:20:20 PM 
It is May 20 and less than half of the portal entrants between D1 and D2 have committed to a new school.
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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 6:50:01 PM 
shabamon wrote:
It is May 20 and less than half of the portal entrants between D1 and D2 have committed to a new school.


Sure if you include D2, but if you only look at D1 1232 out of 2032 have signed. 60.6%

As always the biggest/best mostly sign first and each tier successively fills in the gaps later until there's no spots left. Explains why D2 has lower percent signed than D1.

There will also be a certain percent, say 10-20% who end up either deciding not to play or ending up without a chair.

Means closer to 67-76% done of those that eventually will sign.
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 11:14:35 PM 
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.


I'm cool with standards, but I doubt everyone remaining falls under those categories. We also took a chance on Paveletzke as a two-time transfer (Jason Carter too, if you count that). Point being, I'd like to think there are a few guys still unsigned worth bringing in that wouldn't be problems.



I can live with Paveletzke looking for quality PT.

It bothers me more in football when kids are coming into programs in May or June... not able to get up to speed... and then are back into the portal by December. THAT is a huge NCAA error that should be cleaned up.


Itís the federal court system,not the NCAA.
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/20/2024 11:15:27 PM 
GraffZ06 wrote:
shabamon wrote:
It is May 20 and less than half of the portal entrants between D1 and D2 have committed to a new school.


Sure if you include D2, but if you only look at D1 1232 out of 2032 have signed. 60.6%

As always the biggest/best mostly sign first and each tier successively fills in the gaps later until there's no spots left. Explains why D2 has lower percent signed than D1.

There will also be a certain percent, say 10-20% who end up either deciding not to play or ending up without a chair.

Means closer to 67-76% done of those that eventually will sign.


Which is the historical average.
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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/21/2024 8:38:23 AM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
M.D.W.S.T wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
SBH wrote:
Boals has made it clear that he will not go after kids with character issues, grade problems or those who have been in the portal multiple times


This adds a layer of complexity to the equation as well. I 100% support Jeff on having these standards for the program, but it likely eliminates large swaths of players.

Just because Player A, is in the portal and unsigned and is 6'8+ doesn't mean we do or should have interest.

Just like interviews in business. The resume and qualifications get you the interview but it's your interpersonal skills and how you fit with the team and culture that determines whether you're actually offered. Boals has to find that team and culture fit. It's a tough job and why he earns the big bucks.


I'm cool with standards, but I doubt everyone remaining falls under those categories. We also took a chance on Paveletzke as a two-time transfer (Jason Carter too, if you count that). Point being, I'd like to think there are a few guys still unsigned worth bringing in that wouldn't be problems.



I can live with Paveletzke looking for quality PT.

It bothers me more in football when kids are coming into programs in May or June... not able to get up to speed... and then are back into the portal by December. THAT is a huge NCAA error that should be cleaned up.


Itís the federal court system,not the NCAA.


Courts made it okay to transfer 14 times and be eligible. They didn't set the dates.
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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/21/2024 10:48:05 AM 
It's a shame more of the kids don't recognize that if they are sitting the bench at low-mid-major state tech, pro ball is not in their future in any corner of the globe, thus they would be well off to turn their papers in on time and get a degree that will benefit them for the next 40-50 years.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/21/2024 12:14:57 PM 
greencat wrote:
It's a shame more of the kids don't recognize that if they are sitting the bench at low-mid-major state tech, pro ball is not in their future in any corner of the globe, thus they would be well off to turn their papers in on time and get a degree that will benefit them for the next 40-50 years.


Men's D1 basketball graduation rates reached an all-time high of 86% in 2023.
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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/21/2024 12:37:17 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
greencat wrote:
It's a shame more of the kids don't recognize that if they are sitting the bench at low-mid-major state tech, pro ball is not in their future in any corner of the globe, thus they would be well off to turn their papers in on time and get a degree that will benefit them for the next 40-50 years.


Men's D1 basketball graduation rates reached an all-time high of 86% in 2023.


To be fair he said a degree that will benefit them.
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100%Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/22/2024 11:40:51 AM 
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/22/2024 12:19:28 PM 
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


This is why I don't love the idea of banking schollies. Who knows what this roster looks like at the conclusion of next season. We're in win now mode with so many returnees and upperclassmen. Find another piece to the puzzle that can help now, worry about 25/26 at the end of 24/25.
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FormerMember
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/22/2024 12:54:49 PM 
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


I think Boals has shown he wants a mixture of players. He's gone after upperclassmen transfers as well as high school seniors. The hope is that you can retain the youngsters for a few seasons and limit the roster turnover on a yearly basis.

It's not guaranteed to work but it should help with roster retention since you'll commit less NIL money to unproven players while they're developing with more experienced players in front of them. When the older players leave, it provides the opportunity for the young players to step up. If they haven't shown enough in practice, you can advise them to move on and target more experienced transfers. It's honestly not a bad strategy if Boals can continue to cultivate a successful culture with the "right type of guys"

The Akron method is hit-or-miss. You can hit a home run and be very successful or you can bomb. Either scenario, it'll likely lead to high turnover on a yearly basis.

So far, the Zips have had more success so it's hard to argue with their approach but it's certainly more of a grind and leaves less margin of error. If you miss out on your intended targets or they don't live up to your expectations, it can make things really difficult.

Last Edited: 5/22/2024 12:59:27 PM by FormerMember

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Jeff McKinney
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/22/2024 5:49:00 PM 
FormerMember wrote:
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


I think Boals has shown he wants a mixture of players. He's gone after upperclassmen transfers as well as high school seniors. The hope is that you can retain the youngsters for a few seasons and limit the roster turnover on a yearly basis.

It's not guaranteed to work but it should help with roster retention since you'll commit less NIL money to unproven players while they're developing with more experienced players in front of them. When the older players leave, it provides the opportunity for the young players to step up. If they haven't shown enough in practice, you can advise them to move on and target more experienced transfers. It's honestly not a bad strategy if Boals can continue to cultivate a successful culture with the "right type of guys"

The Akron method is hit-or-miss. You can hit a home run and be very successful or you can bomb. Either scenario, it'll likely lead to high turnover on a yearly basis.

So far, the Zips have had more success so it's hard to argue with their approach but it's certainly more of a grind and leaves less margin of error. If you miss out on your intended targets or they don't live up to your expectations, it can make things really difficult.


Great post, Former. +1

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FearLeon
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/22/2024 8:34:51 PM 
FJC31 wrote:
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


This is why I don't love the idea of banking schollies. Who knows what this roster looks like at the conclusion of next season. We're in win now mode with so many returnees and upperclassmen. Find another piece to the puzzle that can help now, worry about 25/26 at the end of 24/25.


My philosophy as well. Will be disappointing if we bank the schollie and don't add another portal big for 2024-2025.

Last Edited: 5/22/2024 10:17:28 PM by FearLeon


#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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Bobcat1998
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/23/2024 11:46:52 AM 
FearLeon wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


This is why I don't love the idea of banking schollies. Who knows what this roster looks like at the conclusion of next season. We're in win now mode with so many returnees and upperclassmen. Find another piece to the puzzle that can help now, worry about 25/26 at the end of 24/25.


My philosophy as well. Will be disappointing if we bank the schollie and don't add another portal big for 2024-2025.


I agree. I don't necessarily need Dwight Wilson but I also don't want to settle on Vic Searls. I would absolutely love a Jon Smith.
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shabamon
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/23/2024 1:24:10 PM 
https://x.com/low_madness/status/1793679963855720457

Lots of D1 scholarships available around the country.
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FearLeon
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  Message Not Read  RE: Portal starts up again March 18th
   Posted: 5/23/2024 2:35:57 PM 
Bobcat1998 wrote:
FearLeon wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
100%Cat wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Hard to dispute that, there does not seem to be much in the way of notable incoming freshmen around the MAC while we boast Elliott, Evans, & Burris. Call me crazy but I'd prefer this to Akron-like transfer excitement.


To an extent, I agree. My hesitation is that this is the "transfer age" and it feels like Boals is trying to build a program from youth in an era when the youth doesn't often stay where they started. I know we've done well the past couple of years of retaining talent, but in any given season, we can be gutted. Akron may have to reboot their roster every couple of years, but the guys they are bringing in seem more likely to contribute immediately rather than develop in the program and play in a year or two. If we develop guys and keep them here, I'm all for it. I just can't depend on that happening in the current era.


This is why I don't love the idea of banking schollies. Who knows what this roster looks like at the conclusion of next season. We're in win now mode with so many returnees and upperclassmen. Find another piece to the puzzle that can help now, worry about 25/26 at the end of 24/25.


My philosophy as well. Will be disappointing if we bank the schollie and don't add another portal big for 2024-2025.


I agree. I don't necessarily need Dwight Wilson but I also don't want to settle on Vic Searls. I would absolutely love a Jon Smith.


+1


#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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